Replacing standard Jabsco toilet

[John Langford]

Does anyone know if the standard Jabsco toilet on the MkII is attached by lag bolts so that the old Jabsco toilet can be removed and a new Jabsco bolted on without having access to nuts/washers under the attachment point?

Cheers,
John

[Stu Jackson]

John

All the one's I've seen have lag bolts into the floor (the raised little section of the deck) in the head.

Don't know if you already have the replacement head, but Peggy Hall recommends the Raritan PH II as the best head.  I believe they also make a smaller model of the head that would fit better in our boats.  It's a smaller bowl with the same pump mechanism.

We have a Wilcox Crittenden Head Mate that's been doing fine, and I would probably just replace the head with the same one so I don't have to do the new hoses routine.  Our head is lag bolted in, too.  I serviced it a few years ago, and just bought a new pump assembly for it.  Now I have to get one of those plastic bolts that holds the seat cover onto the bowl.  Always something...

Good luck,

Stu

[Ron Hill]

John : Unless a PO did something really weird, your head is secured by lag bolts.  
One of the problems is that the factory used a drill to screw in those bolts and probably "rounded out the holes" by over-tightening.  Take some epoxy and "paint the edges" of the old holes to get a better grip when securing the new head.  
Let the epoxy dry overnight - you might want to "add" a piece of toothpick when painting the holes.
A thought.  APACHE #788  

[John Langford]

Thanks for the tips. Changed the toilet (Jabsco for Jabsco) in under 40 minutes (is it a world record???) including attaching the new seat and testing. The lag bolts went back in nice and tight. West Marine has the Jabsco compact on sail for under $100 so the incentive to switch to Raritan was low.

Cheers,
John

[Don Wexler]

40 minutes... Congratulations! Mine took all day.  PO epoxied? the steel ( not stainless ) Lag screws in.  They rusted and snapped off.  Three drill bits and one easy-out later I gave up and re-drilled them 1/2 inch offset.  Old screws are hidden under toilet flange so it looks OK.  Now on to the remaining hoses..

[John Langford]

Sorry to hear that yours took so long Dan, but amused to see this ancient thread revived.

An update on the Jabsco I installed in 2004. Two years later it has become addicted to head lubricant. If it doesn't get its weekly fix it starts squeaking loudly when it is pumped. Kate, in particular, does not find the noise all that amusing. I believe the WM head lube is just mineral oil but I hate using it so regularly. Has anyone had a similar problem and found a more effective and longer lasting lubricant?

[Stu Jackson]

Try Super Lube, available in spray aerosol cans and tubes (jelly-like).  I remember that one of our former Tech Editors, Bill Nuttal, had also discussed this issue in Tech Notes.  Peggie Hall covers it in her book.

[Ron Hill]

John :There's a reason that they sell "Head Lube"!!!  I believe that it's vegable oil - repackaged. 
Do NOT try waterproof grease or Kate will really be unhappy when it takes two hand on the pump to flush!!   

[dave davis]

:cry4`I recently replaced my Jabsco head which was on sale at WM. I was forever fussing with the old head just to keep it somewhat working. I never liked the total mechanism and design of the Jabsco. They did make small improvement in the design over the years, but it never seemed to work quite right. So, when I gave up replacing parts, I decided to try this bran new out of the box Jabsco. That was my BIG mistake. It never seemed to be working quite right. I only use the head for liquid contributions but I have to pump at least 10 times on the wet side just to get rid of the yellow and several times on the dry side which never goes dry. If you pump too fast it shoots up toward your face. What a bummer.
I am now on the look out for a decent head. When I visit other boats, I always tryout their head and take notes.
It would be nice if the head was about 4 inches higher to get it above the water line. I may add a platform. I have been living with a Jabsco for 18 years. It has not been very high on the priority list. It does not effect boat speed.

[Stephen Butler]

Like many others, we took advantage of the $100 deal at WM and replaced our Jabsco head.  We had thought about upgrading to a better, or at least more expensive head, but elected to go with the lower-priced and exact fit replacement. So far, no problems.  After making this replacement, we suffered through the usual buyer's remorse, until we were invite about a couple of 45+ foots...both of which had multiple heads and all of which were the same Jabsco's we have about our C34.  I asked about this and both owners said that for the price, and expected useful life (3 to 5 years), they preferred to just replace regularly...less hassle and lower costs.  Like these big-boys, we will now be replacing the entire head every few years....and have already returned our parts kits to WM.  Just a thought.

[Stu Jackson]

Seem that there are a number of issues here.

1.  Easy replacement - yes, we've been there, too.  We have a Wilcox Crittendon Head Mate and, as previously noted, have been the rebuild, replace pump assembly part, replace whole thing course over the years.  We will most likely continue to do so.  We bought our latest complete head at a great price at Svendsen's in Alameda during a sale they had for Catalina owners awhile back, thanks to whoever set that up.

2.  Inability of Jabsco to pump anything.  I think that's what Dave is talking about.

Our experience with Jabsco heads on bareboats is that they are the lowest of the low when it comes to their ability to move anything, liquid or crystal.

The W/C Head Mate we have is about middle of the road, it ain't great, but it works.  When Vic MaKau first got his #1688 he posted about what he considered his Head Mate's poor operation.  I visited his boat and brought him over to mine.  He was comparing a VERY good major marine head he'd had on a bareboat in British Columbia with the toys we have on our boats.  While he wasn't satisfied, he understood that this is what the W/C HM gives you, but it's still a heck of a lot better than the Jabscos.

Peggie Hall, who I've mentioned before, is an expert on heads and has published an entire book on boat odors and very good recommendations on heads and head systems.  You can get it at  www.catalinaowners.com.  She recommends the Raritan PHII as the best buy - a little more expensive, but will last ten years or more, and has good operation.

So, you almost get what you pay for.  In my estimation, the Jabsco is a piece of junk, you might as well use a bucket!  The W/C Head Mate is a bit better and actually pumps, and I can live with it.  And I don't feel like redoing my hoses for a Raritan, yet...

[John Langford]

Does the Raritan II work in a MkII head compartment? I was wondering if the handle on the right would block entry or stop the door from closing. Also, what is the hose replacement issue? Don't both Jabsco and Raritan use 3/4"in and 1 1/2" out?

[Stu Jackson]

John, just noticed you hadn't gotten an answer to this one.  I'm not sure about the Raritan handle, but my understanding is that you can switch the base to make the handle end up on the left (aft) side of the bowl.  The only difference in the hoses is where they come in and go out, so if the head outlet hose is in a different place, it may require the replacement of the hose, or trimming of the hose.  Your choice if you want to replace the hose for the new head based on what you currently have installed.  The other smaller hoses are less of an inconvenience to replace.  My suggestion would be to go to www.catalinaonwers.com and ask Peggie directly on her Experts Forum section.

Added 4/14/09 - The answer is here: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,3797.0

[John Langford]

Thanks Stu. I would like to keep the handle on the right side so sometime I will find one and measure the throw of the handle. In the meantime I took the advice re using teflon grease and it has transformed the performance of the head. Sometimes the simplest things...

[Ron Hill]

John : Use the your grease sparingly so you don't leave the excess in the hoses and holding tank !!