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Author Topic: Requirment for no discharge zone  (Read 3360 times)

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Indian Falls

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Requirment for no discharge zone
« on: June 01, 2011, 07:58:14 PM »

I replaced all the sanitation hoses and repaired the macerator which now gets connected to a through hull for overboard discharge. 

 Lake Ontario is No Discharges Zone. 

I just spent over an hour trying to find specific instructions pertaining to making my system legal in the Great lakes including combing the coastguard.mil site.

All I can find is two statements:   
1.) hoses pipes must be permanently removed 
2.) locking the head door or seacock, removing seacock handle etc.  see 40 CFR Part 140 for more information.   

Searching for this is a circular dead end.  I can't seem to find a specific paragraph that says what is acceptable. 

The PO whom was from Canada, had the hose from the macerator output capped with an easily unscrewed plumbing cap on the hose barb that normally screwed into the seacock.  The seacock had only a pipe plug installed.  I can't even find literature that indicates this was legal.

Any help or link to Coast guard regulations would be much appreciated!!!
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Dan & Dar
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Footloose

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2011, 02:37:32 AM »

Dan,

FWIW-I took the mascerator out, removed all of the hoses, and put a plug in the holding tank.  Others that I know of on Lake Champlain have done the same.

Dave
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Dave G.
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Hull# 608á 1988 Tall Rig/Fin Keel
Malletts Bay, VT- Lake Champlain

Ken Juul

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2011, 04:38:19 AM »

A phone call to the CG or CG aux should get you the answers. 

Since I do have access to the ocean, disconnecting and plugging isn't required.  But since I am in a no discharge zone, the local CG Aux suggested that rather than taking the handles off the marlon valves (not a good idea), drill a small hole in the end of the thru hull handle and safety wire it in the closed position.  I have passed all my CG safety inspections this way.
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Peggie Hall

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2011, 02:03:54 PM »

Federal law (33 CFR 159.7) lists the acceptable ways of securing the sanitation system in "no discharge" waters" (note that the acceptable means of securing Type I and II MSDs (treatment devices) are not acceptable means of securing a holding tank (Type III).

(b) When operating a vessel on a body of water where the discharge of treated or untreated sewage is prohibited by the Environmental Protection Agency under 40 CFR 140.3 or 140.4, the operator must secure each Type I or Type II device in a manner which prevents discharge of treated or untreated sewage. Acceptable methods of securing the device includeŚ

(1) Closing the seacock and removing the handle;

(2) Padlocking the seacock in the closed position;

(3) Using a non-releasable wire-tie to hold the seacock in the closed position; or

(4) Locking the door to the space enclosing the toilets with a padlock or door handle key lock.


(c) When operating a vessel on a body of water where the discharge of untreated sewage is prohibited by the Environmental Protection Agency under 40 CFR 140.3, the operator must secure each Type III device in a manner which prevents discharge of sewage. Acceptable methods of securing the device includeŚ

(1) Closing each valve leading to an overboard discharge and removing the handle;

(2) Padlocking each valve leading to an overboard discharge in the closed position; or

(3) Using a non-releasable wire-tie to hold each valve leading to an overboard discharge in the closed position.


All of the above is acceptable on all the Great Lakes in both US and Canadian waters...but NOT on Lake Champlain. NY state marine sanitation law for Champlain requires that there be no plumbing connected to any overboard discharge pump or thru-hull. 
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Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "The NEW Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://www.amazon.com/New-Get-Rid-Boat-Odors/dp/1892399784/

Indian Falls

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #4 on: June 03, 2011, 07:42:47 PM »

Thank you Peggy.   

Review these concerning 40 CFR 140.3:

http://edocket.access.gpo.gov/cfr_2002/julqtr/pdf/40cfr140.3.pdf

http://law.justia.com/cfr/title40/40-22.0.1.1.2.0.1.3.html

I am trying to corroborate your information with a "significantly official"  printable source so that when "Joe Coast Guard" boards my vessel in either Canada or the US and sees a zip tie on my through-hull handle and whips out his citation booklet, I can provide the literature that he is unaware of due to sleeping in class during his waterway education class...   neither of the above "letter of the law" links found with a search for 40 CFR 140.3  describe in any fashion how or why or what is acceptable in rendering a system legal from overboard discharge. 

T h e y   a r e   n o t   g o i n g   t o  t a k e  m y  w o r d  f o r  i t   
t h a t   P e g g y  H a l l   s a i d   t h i s   i s   o k.

Peggy, could you cite the source of your last post?  I've been searching for hours and I cannot arrive at any similar text in relation to 140.3

Have a look at the screen shot from my visit to the USCG web site....
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Dan & Dar
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Peggie Hall

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #5 on: June 03, 2011, 09:29:33 PM »

You're looking in the wrong place.  You won't find sanitation regs on the USCG site because they aren't Coast Guard regs, they're FEDERAL regulations...found IN the Code of Federal Regulations ("CFR").

You'll find a downloadable printable version of 33 CFR 159.7  "Requirements for Vessel Operators" here:

http://cfr.vlex.com/vid/159-7-requirements-vessel-operators-19764518

That's the ONLY part of 33 CFR 159 that you need.

You don't need 40 CFR 140.3 at all...it doesn't include any requirements for vessel operators nor anything beyond "does the boat have the necessary equipment on it" for law enforcement to enforce.

Don't fall into the trap a lot people have fallen into--getting so wrapped up in the minutia of the CFR that you get tangled up in what applies to whom, when.  I just went through that on a trawler site with someone who was determined to apply the the process that Type I and II mfrs have to follow to get their devices certified by the CG to his own holding tank.

« Last Edit: June 03, 2011, 09:40:33 PM by Peggie Hall »
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Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since 1987
Author "The NEW Get Rid of Boat Odors - A Guide To Marine Sanitation Systems and Other Sources of Aggravation and Odor"
http://www.amazon.com/New-Get-Rid-Boat-Odors/dp/1892399784/

n624ma

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2011, 04:07:10 AM »

Here is the link to the Code of Federal Regulations (all of them).

http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&tpl=%2Findex.tpl

The web site at the Government Printing Office has lot of regulatory info.

http://www.gpoaccess.gov/
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Joseph Rheubeck

Indian Falls

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2011, 06:47:15 AM »

Oh! Federal as in CFR (forehead smack!)  For some reason I thought if the CG was enforcing it, it should be on their site somewhere.

Thanks! Guys!  That ought to do it! 

I'd like to keep the official rule, from an official source printed on board in the log book just in case some over zealous inspector has personal objections to wire ties, handle removal, or lock and key. 

You have to cover your "southern region" at all times these days.  I certainly don't trust the authorities to be 100% perfect .

Thanks again!
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Dan & Dar
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Indian Falls

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Re: Requirment for no discharge zone
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2011, 04:37:39 AM »

UPDATE

I was working on the boat this weekend and a Coast Guard Auxillary inspector stopped by to do free inspections.  I declined as everything was all apart down below... but we talked a bit and I learned I knew more about the rules concerning no discharge zones than he did.  (all thanks to the folks on this thread)
I'm not saying he doesn't know what he's talking about and I'm certain he does adequate work in his volunteer capacity.   That's the reason I'd like to have the paperwork on board.  ( I may be a bit pretentious, he wasn't aware of any "grey water" no discharge zones in some parks in the great lakes region. )

« Last Edit: June 06, 2011, 01:45:14 PM by indianfalls »
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Dan & Dar
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