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Author Topic: MK 11 Weight  (Read 2696 times)

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Tom Clay

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MK 11 Weight
« on: October 14, 2009, 08:26:17 PM »

We hauled the boat last weekend and painted the bottom with Pettit Trinidad hard paint, waxed the hull and changed the zincs. We should be good for another 3-4 years as that is how long the last bottom paint lasted.

We had the hoist driver give us a weight on the boat..... 20,000lbs, 8,000 on the front 12,000 on the rear. I knew she was heavy as I have read previous posts about the C34's weight, but the total really surprised me. We only had 20 gallons of water and 12 gallons of fuel, a 2000 watt Honda generator, 10' rubber boat with 2HP Honda, and misc. other items on board, nothing with any real weight.

Now I know why she feels like a much bigger and heavier boat, and why it takes heavy wind well.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2009, 08:28:45 PM by Tom Clay »
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Tom and Lynn Clay
2006 34' Hull #1760......Somewhere
Olympia, Wa.

Craig Illman

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #1 on: October 15, 2009, 06:18:24 AM »

Tom - I guess I don't feel too bad about my 18,000#. It must be that one-ton, bomb-proof full enclosure you have around your cockpit. Or maybe all that canvas has soaked up a lot of the rain. You sure you put on zincs and not depleted uranium?

Craig
« Last Edit: October 15, 2009, 06:19:14 AM by Craig Illman »
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Ken Heyman

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #2 on: October 15, 2009, 06:50:36 AM »

guys,

take a look at the discussion of weight and displacement------


http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,3213.0.html

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Ken Heyman
1988 c34 #535
"Wholesailor"
Chicago, Il

Albreen

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2009, 08:35:01 AM »

My impression after two seasons with a C34 MK I is she sails much bigger and reacts to wind and waves like a heavier displacement boat. I thought this might be due to having a moderate sized genoa - a 130%. If like the MK II, it never occurred to me it could simply be a heavier boat. Our C34 sits high on her waterline despite full gear, equipment, and tankage. A nice feature of the design, the capacity for load in pounds/inch is rated at 1,251 and will absorb a lot of equipment and fluids before she sinks noticeably lower in the water.  :D
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Paul Leible
1987 C34 "ALBREEN", SR/FK, M25XP
Sailing Lake Champlain

Ron Hill

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2009, 05:46:06 PM »

Guys , Susan and D.Gill : This is a C34 discussion that started back about 1990.
 
Here's what we know for sure : Gerry Douglas admitted that Catalina missed the design draft of the C34 that was published at (Wing keel) 3' 10".  Catalina restated that the draft of a C34 was really 4' 3".  
In your High School Physics class you learned Archimedes principle.  It simply states that an object will displace its weight in water equal to the weight of the object.  Therefore if the C34 was designed to have a draft of 3'10" and it sinks down into the water deeper, because it weighs more than the design weight of 12,550 lbs (est.)
The other known : is that marina operators seldom (if ever) have their "strain gages" recalaberated.  These gages are the instruments that will give you the weight readings.  Cranes and other industrial machines are required by most States/localities to have their strain gages recaliberated periodically and there is a certified sticker on the machine with the date it was done.

When that Catalina announcement (of the increase in draft) was announced my C34 was on the hard and I immediately measured the draft which was 4" 5".  My boat is probably loaded with more items than most.  It wasn't a surprise to me, as I'd touched bottom using the 3'10" draft number.  
I'll guess that a C34 is between 15 & 16,000 lbs loaded for cruising.

These are my thoughts and experience on the gross weight (displacement) issue and don't believe that I'm that far off!!   :wink:
« Last Edit: October 15, 2009, 05:52:09 PM by Ron Hill »
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Tom Clay

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #5 on: October 15, 2009, 10:27:53 PM »

After reading some of the older posts it appears that the MK11's are coming in at 17,000-18,000lbs. Could it be that the change in the aft hull design above the water line of the MK11 added 1000-2000 lbs. to the boat?

I suspect the gauges were not calibrated on the lift that was used on our boat, the operator also did not subtract for any part of the hoist.

I really expected to see a weight in the 15,000-16,000 range as Ron has stated on multiple occasions.

Craig, you know the Admiral would never give up all of that canvas, even if it does add a ton to the boat.... and the canvas was dry when we weighed.....LOL
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Tom and Lynn Clay
2006 34' Hull #1760......Somewhere
Olympia, Wa.

Albreen

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #6 on: October 16, 2009, 08:58:05 AM »

By increasing the displacement to 17,000 and adding 1" to the waterline for the additional pounds, the standard C34 ratios of a SR/FK model would be modified as below:

Performance Comparison
         
LOA                             Catalina 34 SR/Fin        34.5
                               Cat34 +                     34.5

LWL                             Catalina 34 SR/Fin        29.8
                               Cat34 +                     30.8

Beam                             Catalina 34 SR/Fin        11.75
                               Cat34 +                     11.75

Displacement                Catalina 34 SR/Fin        11950
                               Cat34 +                     17000

Sail Area                             Catalina 34 SR/Fin        564
                               Cat34 +                     564

Capsize Ratio                Catalina 34 SR/Fin        2.06   Less than 2 indicates good stability in bad conditions
                               Cat34 +                     1.83

Hull Speed                Catalina 34 SR/Fin        7.31
                               Cat34 +                     7.44

Sail Area to                Catalina 34 SR/Fin        17.26  Questionable metric.  <13 is probably a motor sailor  >18 considered high performance
Displacement                  Cat34 +                     13.65

Displacement to LWL   Catalina 34 SR/Fin        202   200 considered medium weight boat
                               Cat34 +                     260   300 considered heavy boat

LWL to Beam                Catalina 34 SR/Fin        2.54  range is generally 2.3 to 3.0
                               Cat34 +                     2.62

Motion Comfort                Catalina 34 SR/Fin        22.05 Range is 5-60+  Higher is more stable
                               Cat34 +                     30.68

Pounds/Inch                Catalina 34 SR/Fin        1251  amount of weight required to sink the boat 1"
                               Cat34 +                     1293

Credit to Carl's Sail Calculator at http://www.image-ination.com/sailcalc.html


« Last Edit: October 16, 2009, 09:23:03 AM by Ken Juul »
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Paul Leible
1987 C34 "ALBREEN", SR/FK, M25XP
Sailing Lake Champlain

Stu Jackson

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #7 on: October 16, 2009, 09:13:07 AM »

So, what that means is that I should run right out and add more weight to my boat because

1.  The waterline is lengthened, so I can go faster!

2.  The comfort ratio is better, so it sails better.

Whoopie!  Now, more tools or more anchor chain???? :D
« Last Edit: October 16, 2009, 09:13:28 AM by Stu Jackson »
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite"  Cowichan Bay, BC  Maple Bay Marina  SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)

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Ken Juul

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #8 on: October 16, 2009, 09:28:54 AM »

I added some definitions to the metrics.  Not so sure you want to add too much more weight....according to the SA to Disp figure, the C34+ is approaching motor sailor status  :?
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Ken & Vicki Juul
Luna Loca #1090
Chesapeake Bay
Past Commodore C34IA

Albreen

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Re: MK 11 Weight
« Reply #9 on: October 16, 2009, 09:53:48 AM »

LOL - it's always a fun exercise to play with ratios! So, Stu can add the weight on and Ken can put up a huge genny! We'll be sailing like an Cape Dory before you know it!  :D
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Paul Leible
1987 C34 "ALBREEN", SR/FK, M25XP
Sailing Lake Champlain
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