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Author Topic: Alternator problem  (Read 338 times)

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Dwayne Godfrey

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Alternator problem
« on: July 10, 2020, 02:15:34 PM »

Alternator what is everyone using our po put a Balmar 712-80 and after eating 2 belts in 10 minutes and getting toed back to port I put a tester on it and itís junk we use a lot of power I have a c-pap and canít live without our  Keurig I also figured out that the problems with the tack was because the alternator was  dying Iíve tried to educate myself but still feel I need some help I want to put a big enough alternator that I donít have to worry about power we have four house batteries and a starter battery
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Ron Hill

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2020, 03:15:09 PM »

Dwayne : Take your Balmar to an alternator shop and have it rebuilt.  They can tell you what size they can rebuild to.  I went from a 75A to 120A.  Don't know what you have for an external voltage regulator or what it maybe set at?, but look at an ARS 5 or MAX.

If you are eating up belts you also need to look at the belt alignment.  The alternator case might need to be moved back or fwd beside looking at twist of the case/pulley. 

A few thoughts
« Last Edit: July 10, 2020, 03:16:24 PM by Ron Hill »
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Stu Jackson

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2020, 08:29:32 PM »

Dwayne,

You might want to wander around this:

Electrical Systems 101   http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5977.0.html

and the tech wiki

Ron's right about the external regulator.

Please help us to help you by telling us your hull #, year, and engine.
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite"  Cowichan Bay, BC  Maple Bay Marina  SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)

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Dwayne Godfrey

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #3 on: July 11, 2020, 07:17:48 AM »

Ok so I think the hull number is no 943261 itís an 89 and we have a universal 25 this is our first boat so trying to learn as we go the po just did day sailing we want to go places and are on a mooring so we never plug in in the reading I have  done when you go up to 120 you should convert to a serpentine belt has anyone done this we also have a couple solar panels but from what I have read solar is only to top off the batteries not to charge them there is so much info my head is spinning I know we have an external regulator should I replace it with the alternator and get the kit I donít think rebuilding what I have is going to work time wise
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Dwayne Godfrey

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #4 on: July 11, 2020, 07:20:52 AM »

Also the hour meter never worked since we have had the boat and the tack only worked sometimes is that a wiring. Problem maybe the po did something incorrectly when he installed the alternator
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Ron Hill

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #5 on: July 11, 2020, 11:56:56 AM »

Dwayne : You'll never know about a rebuild until you take the alternator to a shop and have them look at it!!  Get a new alternator and you maybe looking at a new problem of mounting and getting it aligned. Rebuild the old alternator and you eliminated that mounting problem!!

BTW, the tach gets it signal from the alternator.  So not surprised that the tach and hour meter are not working.

Even though I went up to 120A alternator, thru the voltage regulator I "dumbed" it down to 100A.  Just so I didn't eat up belts!!              Best look at your voltage regulator manual and learn what you already have!

Look at your solar panel/s and I sure that they will charge the batteries as well as keeping them topped off.  You may need a regulator depending how "large"(Watts) the solar panels are ?

A few thoughts
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Stu Jackson

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2020, 04:47:27 PM »

Ok so I think the hull number is no 943261 itís an 89 and we have a universal 25 this is our first boat so trying to learn as we go the po just did day sailing we want to go places and are on a mooring so we never plug in in the reading I have  done when you go up to 120 you should convert to a serpentine belt has anyone done this we also have a couple solar panels but from what I have read solar is only to top off the batteries not to charge them there is so much info my head is spinning I know we have an external regulator should I replace it with the alternator and get the kit I donít think rebuilding what I have is going to work time wise

1.  That hull number makes no sense.  Take a look at the top of your transom, starboard side, the hull # is there.  Or:  what is your sail #?

2.  If you have an 89, it's most likely an M25XP, which has a bigger 3" HX and the upgraded alternator bracket.  Read the Critical Upgrades topic to learn about it.  Also see the tech wiki, under engine:  Alternator mount/bracket upgrade Important safety upgrade for M25 (not XP) owners by Stu Jackson (https://c34.org/wikiwp/?rdp_we_resource=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.c34.org%2Fwiki%2Findex.php%3Ftitle%3DM-25_Alternator_Mount_Chttp://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/macgregor/macgregor-index.htmlonversion_Kit_%2522B%2FM_256891%2522)

3.  What size are your solar panels?  The concept with solar is to use the alternator to get a bulk charge into the batteries, and then use the solar to keep up with your load.  You store the energy in the batteries and use it overnight. Have you done an Energy Budget (see the Electrical 101 topic that I linked to earlier).  A gentleman named Sumner on another boating forum ran a CPAP machine on a much smaller MacGregor 26 sailboat with solar panels and an outboard motor (http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/macgregor/macgregor-index.html), wander around there he did some electrical mods.

4.  The concept with a larger alternator is to get a big alternator and derate it with the external regulator so that the alternator runs cooler and you don't need as serpentine belt.  I run a 100A alternator with a Balmar MC-612 external regulator with the standard 3/8" belt.  Read the Small Engine Mode threads in Elec 101.

I understand how overwhelming this can be, but we've tried to make learning easier by assembling a lot of good helpful articles on just these subjects in the Elec 101 topic.

Good luck.
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mainesail

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2020, 05:28:43 AM »

Alternator what is everyone using our po put a Balmar 712-80 and after eating 2 belts in 10 minutes and getting toed back to port I put a tester on it and itís junk we use a lot of power I have a c-pap and canít live without our  Keurig I also figured out that the problems with the tack was because the alternator was  dying Iíve tried to educate myself but still feel I need some help I want to put a big enough alternator that I donít have to worry about power we have four house batteries and a starter battery

Unfortunately the Balmar 7-Series is no longer repairable, unless a shop has some NOS parts kicking around, or it is just bearings etc... Unfortunately the plant that made those alternators is gone and all the tooling went with it. Going up to a 100 +/- amp alternator can work on the 3/8" belt as long as you use Balmar's Belt Load Manager or "Amp Manager" (Older regs used the term Amp Manager) to limit the current to what the belt can handle..

Your limit on that engine, as far as an alternator is concerned, is the 3/8" belt. The article below can help walk you through what you need to know:
https://marinehowto.com/marine-alternator-installation-tips-tricks/


This article shows how to custom program a Balmar regulator:
https://marinehowto.com/programming-a-balmar-voltage-regulator/

Balmar makes great alternators, but there are now less expensive options in externally regulated alternators..
https://shop.marinehowto.com/t/alternators--regulators


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Ron Hill

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2020, 02:02:09 PM »

Dwayne : If your C34 is a full transom hull, you can also find the hull# under the "Catalina Yachts" placard that is near the gunnel above the rear locker seat lid!! 

A thought   
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Noah

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2020, 03:09:44 PM »

My boat also has a factory number/model description tag glassed over under the V-berth stuck to the forward hanging locker bulkhead.
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Jon W

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2020, 03:52:57 PM »

Hi Dwayne, Is your boat documented with the USCG? I ask because the number 943261 looks like a USCG COD number. If it is, look at your COD and see if thereís a number listed in the ďIMO numberĒ space that starts with ďCTYĒ. If there is, thatís your hull ID number.

I havenít had my boat registered with the state, but would guess the hull ID is listed on the registration also.
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KWKloeber

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2020, 09:34:21 PM »

DG,

943261 is Caribbean's "Official Number" (USCG documentation number.)
Her HID (hull identification number) is CTYP0903J889 or more simply, C34 hull #903
Build year October 1988, 1989 model year

k
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Dwayne Godfrey

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #12 on: July 13, 2020, 05:20:43 PM »

You guys are great my sail number is 903 I didnít know that was the hull number so I think the belt was to loose not a lot of room for adjustment the 40 was to loose. The 39 I had no chance of getting on got a 39 5/8 had to take the bracket off to get it on and the put the bracket back on itís nice and tight and seems to be charging the tack didnít work for the first few minutes it was running but then started working should I replace the tack the hour meter hasnít worked since we got the boat in September there is so much info on here and you guys have been a huge help thank you
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Stu Jackson

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #13 on: July 13, 2020, 05:39:23 PM »

......................
...the 40 was to loose. The 39 I had no chance of getting on got a 39 5/8 had to take the bracket off to get it on and the put the bracket back on itís nice and tight >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

7400 was too long for me.  7395 works just fine.  I even figured out a way to get it on without taking the alternator off.
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite"  Cowichan Bay, BC  Maple Bay Marina  SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)

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Ron Hill

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Re: Alternator problem
« Reply #14 on: July 14, 2020, 03:08:15 PM »

Dwayne : So the alternator is working now?!?  I agree with Stu that a 7395 belt is the best for us, but we don't know the pully (Deep "V" or shallow "V"?) on your alternator - so you are probably correct in the belt size!
 
I'd still check your alignment (take a straight edge from the engine pully to alt. pully and also look down from above for tow in/out).

That 943261 was your original USCG Documentation number which was required to be "firmly affixed to the Hull". 
If you continued to still be USCG documented vessel - then that # is still valid !?

A few thoughts

 
« Last Edit: July 14, 2020, 03:12:47 PM by Ron Hill »
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