I currently have a Variprop that needs to go in for service as for whatever reason it locked up in the forward pitch only, and we ended up bouncing off the fuel dock.
AB Marine said $1000-1600 USD for a service which in Canadian Pesos isn't worth it for 4 months of sailing a year, and the overall hassle of maintaining it.
I have noted that Campbell Sailor seems to be a popular option and against all odds is made in Canada, so no BS exchange rate to USD.
What I'd like to know is for our boats, with an M35B what is the correct diameter, and pitch? I can see from the discussions that there is a bit of a difference of opinion due to the engine and RPM matching=pitch.
Thoughts on what's the right prop for an M35B?
pby : The diameter should be 15" definitely!! Haven't seen the "size " of the blades so you can look at either 11" or 12" of pitch!?!
A thought
I recently bought a campbell sailor. They run different pitches and diameters than stock so Ron's recommendations are not likely accurate for the CS prop. The fellow that sells them has a rather long back log of data and can recommend the correct pitch and diameter for your boat.
Quote from: waughoo on August 25, 2024, 09:39:42 PMI recently bought a campbell sailor. They run different pitches and diameters than stock so Ron's recommendations are not likely accurate for the CS prop. The fellow that sells them has a rather long back log of data and can recommend the correct pitch and diameter for your boat.
AH. What did you end up with seeing as you have one.
I believe LogoFreak has one and it is 14x8? Why not message him? Also, have you asked what the prop maker suggests?
Pbyrne,
I would have to look it up. My best recommendation is to talk to the MFG. He worked with me to achieve max rpm and nailed the pitch and diameter. Thus, mine wont be what you want unless those are your goals. Logo has a different pitch and diameter and has a faster cruise than me. All of this is based off the MFG's vast experience with his product. It is also my understanding that he will re pitch it if needed. Give him a call to chat.
Thanks guys. I'm not trying to be difficult. I just thought there would be similarity in the props when engine is the same.
I've read the forum on CS, and it seemed there was some back and worth with CS to sort it out, which I'd like to avoid (short sailing season, and expensive haulouts), and I couldn't see how there would be a difference between my 34 / M35B powered boat and the next guy.
Part of my thinking is that considering the discussions about the prop pitch, armed with the knowledge on this forum, I would be better prepared to have the conversation with CS.
I put on a 14x7.5 about 2 years ago. It's good, but I think it's slightly over pitched as I don't reach 3000 underway. That's on my 1998 Mkii with the M35BC. As I recall the guy at West by North suggested more pitch, so they do tend to be aggressive with it.
One thing I notice, and this is just my experience, is that there is significantly less surface area on the prop, it's a smaller diameter and the blades are thinner. It relies on the shape to really get the push. Nice when you're sailing, but it seems much more impacted by barnacle growth than my old 2 blade.
Rob
Guys : 15" is the MAX size diameter or you definitely will get hull buffeting!!
A thought
I have a 34 mk2 with the M35B engine with a campbell sailor prop.
Stamped on one side of the hub is"D14 RH P8". On the other side is "S20707"
I have photos, but can't figure out how to attach them.
Craig
Quote from: Schulcb on August 27, 2024, 07:36:03 AM>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
I have photos, but can't figure out how to attach them.
Posting and RESIZING Photos 101 http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,3701.0.html
Reply from west by north below in full. Looks like a 3 blade RH 14x8, is the recommendation. Matches what people have said they have here.
Now, as rmjohns mentions, he's not getting full RPM with 7.5 pitch, let alone 8. Does anyone have any experience to add to rmjohns?
West by North <kelsey@westbynorth.com>
Mon, Aug 26, 4:12 PM (22 hours ago)
to me
Hi Peter,
Thank you for your interest in West by North Industries and the Campbell Sailer Propeller.
This recommendation assumes a Catalina 34 MKII on a Universal M-35B engine (35hp @ 3000 RPM max). Transmission is Hurth HBW-100 with a ratio of 1.79 to 1. Shaft diameter is 1.0 inch and rotation at the prop is RH. Please advise if different.
Based on the above suggested prop size is 3 blade RH 14x8.
The Campbell Sailer has cupped blades and a leading edge foil. This increases prop efficiency converting a larger percentage of available HP directly into thrust. As a result we often size smaller than other manufacturers for a given installation.
The Campbell Sailer offers the perfect balance between powering, maneuvering and low drag performance. It's the lowest drag fixed 3 blade on the market. Up to 35-40% less drag when compared to equivalent size units from other manufacturers. The Campbell prop is renown for how smooth it runs throughout the entire RPM range.
Pricing is CAD $985.00. Freight with Canada Post is (5-6 business days) is CAD $36.00. Ontario HST (13%) will apply. Manufacturing time is approximately 6-8 business days on order.
We accept e-Transfer or credit card via telephone. We can also send you a link to complete payment through PayPal. This is a convenient and secure method to complete credit card payment. PayPal account not required and no additional fees apply.
Let me know if you have any questions.
Smooth sailing,
Kelsey
West by North Industries
778-802-4202
Quote from: Schulcb on August 27, 2024, 07:36:03 AMI have a 34 mk2 with the M35B engine with a campbell sailor prop.
Stamped on one side of the hub is"D14 RH P8". On the other side is "S20707"
I have photos, but can't figure out how to attach them.
Craig
That is what is recommended by CS. Do you find it over pitched? Meaning, can you get to full RPM of 3000?
pby : What does the manufacturer of the Campbell Prop recommend for a C34 with an M35B engine????
A thought
Quote from: Ron Hill on August 27, 2024, 01:49:32 PMpby : What does the manufacturer of the Campbell Prop recommend for a C34 with an M35B engine????
A thought
3 blade RH 14x8.
Then you got your answer!!! :thumb:
A thought
Pbyrne,
Out of curiosity, I looked up my CS dimensions. It is a 13.750 x 7. I am able to reach max RPM at full throttle (about 25 to 50 rpm shy) and cruise at 2400 to 2600 rpm at about 6.25kts and max at about 7.1 to 7.2kts at 3150 rpm.
Quote from: waughoo on August 29, 2024, 08:09:25 AMPbyrne,
Out of curiosity, I looked up my CS dimensions. It is a 13.750 x 7. I am able to reach max RPM at full throttle (about 25 to 50 rpm shy) and cruise at 2400 to 2600 rpm at about 6.25kts and max at about 7.1 to 7.2kts at 3150 rpm.
Interesting. That means what they quoted is over pitched at 14x8...?
Quote from: Ron Hill on August 28, 2024, 01:52:20 PMThen you got your answer!!! :thumb:
A thought
I thought so, but then the 14x7 comment came up! LOL
I dont know that yours would be over pitched at the quoted spec. I am experienci g some cavitation at full revs. I suspect I am on the edge of being under pitched. The mfg offers repitching service as part of purchase. I wouldnt agonize over it.
I have the Campbell Sailer RH14x8 fitted to mine, as recommended by West by North. Beats the nasty Martec folder hands down. Mainly as I can raise the idle to a sensible point and stop the vibration at low idle. Talk to West by North before ordering, get the straight scoop from them. I think mine is slightly over propped as it won't get to 3000rpm. However, that said, I think my diesel is 10 years old and that is probably contributing more to the lower performance of the engine than the prop.
Quote from: Robert Mann on September 06, 2024, 02:37:46 PMI have the Campbell Sailer RH14x8 fitted to mine, as recommended by West by North. Beats the nasty Martec folder hands down. Mainly as I can raise the idle to a sensible point and stop the vibration at low idle. Talk to West by North before ordering, get the straight scoop from them. I think mine is slightly over propped as it won't get to 3000rpm. However, that said, I think my diesel is 10 years old and that is probably contributing more to the lower performance of the engine than the prop.
Yes, I'll call to put in the order. How do you find the performance? One thing I will say for the variprop is it never felt like it struggled to weather with chop. Always plenty of power to punch through.
To be quite honest, I barely motor so my comparison is a bit meaningless. I will say the Martec was lousy going astern and the CS is a considerable improvement on that. Theoretically you will lose some speed under sail as the prop just isn't as hydraulically efficient as a folded one, however I consider the improvement in idle setting, the less hammering on the shaft and skeg shift from forward to astern and the improvement getting out of the slip is worth the slight loss in sailing performance.
Quote from: Robert Mann on September 15, 2024, 12:23:23 PMhowever I consider the improvement in idle setting, the less hammering on the shaft and skeg shift from forward to astern.
Not sure if those points are valid with all folding props? I have a 3-blade Flexofold" and have not experienced those "downsides"
Noah, I don't disagree with you. The points are purely related to the prop the PO of my boat installed. The Martec I had was about the most basic of its kind.
Pbyrne, one or two things to remember, if you are installing the prop. You will need to lap the prop taper to the shaft. Use fine valve grinding compound. Get a tube of Engineers Blue apply a very small amount to the shaft to check that the tapers are mating properly. When the tapers are close the prop will stick hard to the shaft and you might need a puller to separate them. Do not let a boat yard beat your props off with a hammer. This can damage the transmission bearings, never mind other parts. This is a common practice. My shaft is stainless, which replaced the standard bronze one, which the PO damaged when one wing of his folder stuck! The shaft was butchered to fit the Martec prop. This caused me to have to redrill the shaft to allow the cotter pin to be installed. Be prepared when you remove your prop in case similar issues have occurred.
Just so I have a refence point, the C34 MKII came with a 15x9?
https://www.catalinadirect.com/shop-by-boat/other-catalinas/engine/props-etc/propeller-3-blade-15-x-9c-310-c-320-c-34-c-36/
Pbyrne, that is the standard prop. Don't try that diameter and pitch with the Campbell Sailor or you will overload the engine. The shape of the CS blade makes a considerable difference and the 14x8 is the recommended size for Mk II with M35.
Quote from: Robert Mann on October 07, 2024, 05:42:59 PMPbyrne, that is the standard prop. Don't try that diameter and pitch with the Campbell Sailor or you will overload the engine. The shape of the CS blade makes a considerable difference and the 14x8 is the recommended size for Mk II with M35.
Yes, just trying to confirm the standard out of the box prop for reference.
Quote from: pbyrne on October 08, 2024, 01:46:11 PMYes, just trying to confirm the standard out of the box prop for reference.
Confirmed, as far as I know. My 1990 Mk 1.5 has a 15x9 2-blade.
I'm glad someone explained the CS blade shape; I was very confused why everyone was talking about smaller+shallower props on an M35B than I have on my M25XP! Although I wouldn't have expected shape to have THAT much impact. Gearing is also a factor (1.79:1 vs 2.05:1), but the M35 should still have more torque at max speed.
Just saw this post, my CS is a 14X8
Quote from: LogoFreak on October 29, 2024, 08:45:05 AMJust saw this post, my CS is a 14X8
Thanks for this!
I'm about to order. Are you happy with it? I guess you have a similar engine etc?
Hi, I have the universal M35 in my C34. Yea I'm happy with it. If I upgrade it will be to a max prop or similar.
Quote from: LogoFreak on December 17, 2024, 06:25:02 PMHi, I have the universal M35 in my C34. Yea I'm happy with it. If I upgrade it will be to a max prop or similar.
Excellent!
Can I ask you what antifouling you're using? It looks like some kind of hard paint? With the demise of VC17 it would be good to know what else works and is less maintenance.
No it's just ablative micron csc
QuoteWith the demise of VC17
Is VC17 going to be discontinued? I only know that the color red is no longer available.
Jim
Jim, VC17 is no longer available in Canada. I can cross the river and buy it in Port Huron but can't legally bring it home.
QuoteJim, VC17 is no longer available in Canada. I can cross the river and buy it in Port Huron but can't legally bring it home.
Thanks for the clarification. Shame, VC17 worked well, at least in Lake Erie and was easy to use. I'm under the impression that other paints are not compatible, and the bottom will need to be stripped before changing paints. Big job.
Please post if you find a replacement that doesn't need the bottom striped. Or if my information is incorrect.
Jim