Head Issues

[Brad Young]

First time posting.

Let me take you back in time .....

Darlene and I  just brought our first sailboat and after a nice afternoon sail, a great dinner on board.  We settle in for our first night sleeping on the boat (DarBay)  I  double check  all the switches, hatches, lights and even some things that I  didn't  know what they were , but I check it anyways.  Set the head up for we could  use it in the middle of the niter  ......  AAAHHHH, zzzzzzz,.  I was  dreaming of sweet Island coconuts and my  lovely wife gets up out of bed to use the head.  You listen, you can not believe how lucky you are ... she figured out how to pump, flip the switch , and pump again.  She comes back  to bed and wishes you a Merry Christmas. After all it is Christmas eve 2009.  AAAHHH, back to blissful sleep, hoping Santa will bring lots of  electronic gadgets and a new windlass.. AAAHHH,zzzzzz But I awoke to such a Clatter, was it Santa and his tiny reindeer .....errrrrrrrrr No not reindeer.... A motor or a pump... I sprang from the bed to see what was the matter  SQUISH... Every sailors nightmare water in the salon. Did I buy a boat with a big hole in it, are we going to sink, Can I  find the leak, more importantly can I fix the leak ... Calm Down Calm down...  Go to the last thing that was fixed or touch that is usually whats broke ( at least at home) Ah the head... rush there and find water gushing out of it. Flip the switch, pump out the excess water . Clean the salon and bilge and averted another crises at sea.  All is well that ends well.

I have since come home and checked out the C34IA website and tech notes (very very nice). Found the mods that Jim Lamb posted . As you may have guessed this has moved to the top of my to do list.  Now for a few questions.

1) Is this preferred method of fixing this problem?
2) I notice that a footnote was added saying that in later models an anti sipion valve was added to the inlet line. Is this something that can be added to an older model? Instead of cutting holes and adding the loop.
If so does anyone have a pic or part number of the valve.
3)I have also read that you can add a charcoal filter to the vent. Does anyone have a picture of a part number of the charcoal filter.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Brad
C34 Hull #84

[Stu Jackson]

1) Is this preferred method of fixing this problem?
2) I notice that a footnote was added saying that in later models an anti sipion valve was added to the inlet line. Is this something that can be added to an older model? Instead of cutting holes and adding the loop.
If so does anyone have a pic or part number of the valve.
3)I have also read that you can add a charcoal filter to the vent. Does anyone have a picture of a part number of the charcoal filter.

Brad,

Welcome.

1.  No, raising the head is not the only solution.
2.  The antisiphon valve is located right in the hose between the pump and the bowl, not between the intake and the pump on the head.  You may very well have one, look inside the nav station hanging locker.  It's a Marelon antisiphon, looks like a half a circle with a small bump on the top.
3.  Don't do that, it makes things worse.  The most important thing is to assure that the vent is clear.  Check that the stanchion fitting is clear and that there is no material in the vent line by taking off the port settee cushion and following the line all the way up; may require removing some woodwork, but that's a great learning experience.

There is a sign on the door under the head sink, starts with: "Important..."

[Stu Jackson]

Antisiphon devices are called vented looops, and look like this:

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/producte/10001/-1/10001/50243/377%20710%201507/712//Primary%20Search/mode%20matchallpartial/0/0?N=377%20710%201507&Ne=712&Ntt=&Ntk=Primary%20Search&Ntx=mode%20matchallpartial&Nao=0&Ns=0&keyword=forespar%20antisiphon&isLTokenURL=true&storeNum=11&subdeptNum=70&classNum=77

[Ron Hill]

Brad : Go to the Jabco web site and look at their "vented loop" arrangment for their heads.
You also might want to check the float switch on your bilge pump !   A thought

[Mike and Joanne Stimmler]

Brad,
When your flood happened, was the lever in the flush position or the dry bowl position? If it was in the flush position, this is kind of normal but if you keep it in the dry bowl position after using, it should not flood like it did. Of course if you're going to be away from the boat, then you need to close the through hull valve.

Mike

P.S. Did Santa bring the windlass?

[Hawk]

Even in the dry bowl position, often the rubber duck valve located after the pump assembly in the discharge line will inevitably start leaking so that the bowl fills. If your sea cock is open it could continue to overflow. You should replace that rubber valve in any case.
Although, it sounds like the amount of overflow you experienced is from another cause.

Hawk

[Ron Hill]

Brad : There are two ways to make the head overflow that I know of :
1.  Let the Dry/Wet bowl lever in WET bowl position (with the thru hull open) !!
2.  Have the inlet hose fitting on the underside pump assembly break off (with the thru hull open)!!  This happened to me, but I was luckily on the hard!  This caused me to invent a slightly different vented loop system from what Jabsco recommends.

[Stu Jackson]

Guys, it's

BOWL

there is no

  e  

[Brad Young]

Wow what a wealth of information.
Thanks for all the help.
Here is what I have found out.
1) This is not an uncommon problem.  Believe it or not that is a relief
2) I can fix it by: doing nothing, however making sure the thru hull is closed and the wet/dry level is in the dry position.
or
3) I can fix it by : adding a vented loop. (which is what I will do)
4) I did not get my electric windlass for Christmas. Perhaps next year

Thanks again
brad

[Stu Jackson]

Remember, the vented loop goes between the pump and the bowl, and NOT between the thru hull and the head.

[Ken Heyman]

Stu,

aha-so it's bowl!---no wonder my gastroentrolologist had no idea what a "vented loop" was when he was consulted. It could have been painful.

Ken

[Brad Young]

It has been said twice. Between the pump and the head. Not the thru hole and the pump.
Why??
I have a Groco head, any ideas on how to get the vented loop between the pump and the head?


Thanks
brad
hull #84

[waterdog]

You can put the vented loop between the inlet and the head.   The problem is now you are sucking air and water and you'll end up with a lot more air than water.   If you put the vented loop after the pump, but before the bowl and the bowel, your pump sucks only water, but you still have the vent to break the siphon.   I've actually tried it in both positions.  It works either way, but it's always best to do what Stu says.   You can tuck the vented loop up behind the shower curtain rather than going through the wall and into the cabinet - you are way more likely to properly maintain it if it's accessible.