Bio Diesel

[Ken Juul]

Thought this was an interesting article.  Posted for information, not trying to start another long BioDiesel thread.  Plenty of them can be found with a search.  Marshall Solomon of Marsh Marine is the author.  His info is at the end of the second article.

[DougP]

Interesting articles, but still my question is unanswered.

I have an older ('86) engine. I generally hand fill it at the slip. I'd like to use B20 or better most of the time just to cut some odor and support the developement of the fuel.

My question remains: Can I run B20 without modification? What about topping the tank off with B100 evry so often so I end up with something like B30 B40?

[Larry Robertie]

I make no indication here that I have the answer, just a couple of things to consider.

First, a few years ago I took a one day diesel engine course at Mass Maritime Academy.  When talking about the fuel and winter storage the instructor very matter of factly mentioned how many fishermen add kerosene to their fuel mix in the winter.  This raises the cetaine level and keeps the stuff from coagulating so easily in the cold.  So adding to your regular diesel is not unheard of.

Second, and take this one for what it is worth, on the discovery channel they have this show called mythbusters.  Can you replace diesel with straight french fry fat thing was the topic of one show.  They got an old Mercedes with a diesel, ran it around a track on a quart of diesel then tried the same thing with the fry fat.  All they did was filter the fry fat - and it worked.  The darn Mercedes went around the track just about the same distance as with Diesel.


Now... nice results sure, but I'd like to see some real solid research done with accelerated were tests and the like.  But this stuff certainly looks promissing.

And no, I'm not pouring any fry fat in my tank - just yet.

[Tom Soko]

DougP,
I've been using B20 in my 1987 M25XP for the past three seasons.  I usually mix B100 and diesel to get about B20.  Plus or minus a little does not seem to matter.  Before I started doing this, I asked Joe Joyce, Service Manager of Westerbeke/Universal.  He said that he knew of many owners using biodiesel, and he had heard of no problems.  Time will tell, but so far I've been very happy.  The "behind the old city bus" smell is gone, and the engine seems to have more power.  Not a dramatic change, but definitely an improvement.

[Ron Hill]

Larry : What do you think the farmers in the northern Mid West did to keep their diesel tractors running in the winter? 
Of course they added kerosene to the diesel (sparingly), however they were also smart enough NOT to do that in the summer!!   

[Larry Robertie]

Well, I don't know... maybe if we did add it in the summer we could have Wednesday night drag races

[Ron Hill]

Larry : What you DON'T want to add to diesel is anything that has a lower "flash point" than diesel OIL.  Best way to screw up a diesel engine, is to have the compression "explosion" while the piston is still coming up!!!!  A thought.   

[Ken Heyman]

Ron,

Combustion while the piston is rising sounds like a really "bad thing". For those of us that struggle to understand the inner workings of these devices what would happen in that event? ---break a rod? - damage or destroy the crankshaft?

Just curious,

Ken

[David Sanner]

With the M25XP there isn't any fuel in the cylinder until about 23 degrees
before the top of the compression stroke (more or less all the way up)
so I would think that unless you accidentally put gasoline in your tank
our engines are more than designed to handle any predetonation
that might occur.  (M25XP pistons are nearly a 1/2 inch thick on top)


I was just reading about cetane... in basic terms it's a rating on
the fuel's ignition quality.  Higher cetane leads to easier starts and
smoother running.  Apparently biodiesel has a very high cetane rating.
And just adding 5% significantly increases lubricity. With the lubrication
issues of ultra low sulfur fuel seems like another reason to add a little
biodiesel.

Getting out from "behind the old city bus" is good enough for me.

[fulvio]

I've been running on B100 for over a year without a problem.  I experimented with various levels of concentration, mostly out of concern for the Webasto heater, but ultimately even that seems to get along with B100 just fine.  During the cold months I opened the port bulkhead in the aft cabin and put a little space heater to blow warm air on the tank.  For the future, I'm thinking of wrapping some sort of resistor heating strip around the tank, wired to run on shorepower.  Just to prevent the fuel from gelling in the cold.

I also wrote a little piece after I talked to one of Seattle's first Biodiesel dealers:
http://www.shilsholecommunity.org/?p=153

[Chris Martinson]

I have 2 questions:

1.  I read and can't remeber where that adding bio Diesel in warm climates - east coast summer time - greatly increases bacterial and other unwanted growth.  Any truth or comments on this?  If a concern, is there anything special to do to prevent this?

2.  Is there a scource of bio diesel in CT on the sound?

Thanks

Chris
More Therapy
Hull #945

[Ted Pounds]

I think adding a bit of biocide (I used to use Bio-Bor) prevents any such problems. 

[David Sanner]

Another interesting article about a major trucking company's test with
B20 (20%) Biodiesel  They are part way through their 2 million mile test.

http://www.greencarcongress.com/2007/03/national_trucki.html

"According to Decker, observations during the study, including oil analysis results, have shown:

    * Cleaner engine oil
    * Positive impact on engine wear
    * Decreased maintenance due to increased lubricity
    * No cold weather issues – even with temperatures in the teens and single digits.

He also said the added lubricity that biodiesel provides would help meet fuel lubricity requirements when used with the newly mandated Ultra Low Sulfur Diesel (ULSD)."

[Phil Spicer]

David, This is a fantastic web site. Went to the biodiesel logo & found my way to a US map. Clicked on Ohio & found I could get bio here in town. But trouble came when the company asked where to send the TRUCK. They were ready to come to the dock until I said I could only take on 25 gal. At this point I was asked what farmers I knew & the supplier  told me who was using bio so I could go to a farmer friend to get my bio. Since that conversation I have also found a station that is on my way to the boat & I can get B2,B5, B10, B20, & B100. The suggestion was made to start with B2, or B5 & let it do its cleaning before I go to B20. I was also told that I would not see any advantage to any mix above B20.
Every one I have talked to has been very willing to educate me about biodiesel.
1. Start with B2, or B5 for about 10 gal while it cleans the system.
2. Check filters often, change as needed.
3. Move to B10 or B20 & be happy .
4. Use the additives to kill the critters & absorb the water.
I'll give it a try.