Engine inspection

[anon]

Hello. I purchased my beautiful boat some 4 months ago now. My "surveyor" gave only the most cursory inspection of my engine.
I am trying to figure out how much money I need to save in order to bring my boat up to great condition and ready for cruising. Thanks to this amazing forum I know mostly what to look at and what questions to ask.
If I wanted to do a health check (self-inspection) on my entire auxiliary power system, (fuel tank to exhaust), is there a check list?
All I know about my engine thus far is: I run the engine for 15 minutes every weekend. She starts just fine. The oil is black (two shades darker than a crow). The PO told me that he had the engine serviced prior to sale so I am dubious about that. The PO only owned the boat for 3 months and I found out last week that the guy he bought it from had left the boat neglected for many months.
When I took her out recently there was a little vibration that came in and then disappeared as revs increased.
I found just want to know what I am dealing with so I can budget. Once I retire I will not have access to new sources of funds and the boat budget will even dictate whether I can call it quits next Spring.
Alternative to me doing a self-inspection how feasible is it for a "specialist" marine diesel engine shop to come out and do a survey?

[KWKloeber]

Pictures pictures pictures?

[Jon W]

When I bought my boat I had a local diesel shop come to the boat and perform a survey of the engine. So I would think you could do the same in your area.

I'm confused though - are you saying you bought the boat knowing you won't have money after you retire next year?

[anon]

  @Jon W.
I am saying that after I retire I will only have a very modest stipend.
All my savings will be going toward bringing the boat up to spec. for cruising from NorCal to Costa Rica. (And back).

[anon]

@Ken
This is the only picture I have of my engine thus far. I will take more. Knowing what to look for will help me know what pics to take.
I took this one to compare the critical alternator mount fix. The travel seems maxed out, maybe need a shorter belt. I also still have the original pulley.
The other ting I noticed was a breather pipe on top of the engine that looks like a hose should be attached.
Still, reference to my original post, is there an idiot's guide to self-inspecting the engine? (If not, I have an opportunity for somebody  )

[KWKloeber]

 Sophie,

Unfortunately I am on the right coast so any diagnosis of things to take care of is going to be virtual. As far as photos the answer is, every square inch that you can photograph will at some point in time be useful to you.   You'll find it amazing how many times you want to go back and reference something or show some buddy what's going on, and bingo you already have a picture of it.

An old salt once told me, when I wanted to do s. PM  on my am-25, "diesels-either they run, or they don't. That's all you need to know." 

And there's a lot of truth to that, but the things that go wrong are typically appurtenances to the engine. The alternator, the heat exchanger, the seawater pump, the harness (we've talked about that),  thermostat, temperature sender, oil pressure switch, etc. etc.  that is, unless an engine has been really abused (run with no oil, no sea water cooling, etc.)

You mentioned the breather hose, that's not currently attached to the valve cover? Under the valve cover there is a filter.   Or are you saying the other and needs to be connected to the air intake?   Rust can be a big issue-I've seen it eat out an oil pan to the point where it leaks.

Did you say you did the alternator bracket upgrade? That looks like an old bracket from the paint. Or did I misunderstand?

kk

[anon]

Thanks so much Ken. I wondered about the paint too but the PO told me all the critical upgrades had been done. I took the picture to get another opinion.

[Ron Hill]

Sophie : Find a C34/36/30 owner with a M25XP engine and ask them to walk you thru an inspection.
Or spend a few bucks $$ and hire a diesel mechanic to do the same.

From your photo you have the correct alternator bracket for the M25XP engine.

A few thoughts

[Stu Jackson]

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Still, reference to my original post, is there an idiot's guide to self-inspecting the engine? (If not, I have an opportunity for somebody  )

Yes, it's called the C34 tech wiki, subject Engine.  Have you read every single last one of those posts?  Really.  It's why we collected them all for you and others.

You should also have downloaded and read the Knowledgebase, engine section.  It's discussed in the Quick Start sticky, with a link to it.

1.  Your hoses are still painted.  Holy Cow!  Replace them all.

2.  Your engine has the corrected alternator bracket. It came with the XP.  Is it aligned properly?  - see the Critical Upgrades topic.

3.  One picture and you are asking for an analysis?  We agree with you, and would need many more photos to even begin.

4.  Going on your planned trip with that alternator won't work.  Read the tech wiki electrical for why.

You are planning a long voyage on a short shoestring.  Almost as bad as sailing to a schedule, but some folks have done it.

Have you read Steve Dolling's summary of his trip from Vancouver to Mexico and all the lessons learned?  He spent over a year getting ready and he'd sailed his boat extensively in British Columbia for a few seasons.  Type in 3596 in the search bar and read away:  those Lessons Learned are very valuable. Oh, here it is:  http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5270.0.html

You have ambitious plans with limited experience.  We're here to help, but it works both ways.  You MUST read, read, read.  Asking for a C34 for Dummies, quite frankly, ain't gonna hack it.

I bought our boat in 1998.  I put off buying a boat with a diesel engine for the 13 years we had our outboard powered Catalina 25.  We bought the boat with known overheating issues.  I read every single Tech Note from 1987 to 1998 and found it was the HX, took it off, cleaned the occluded intake port (NOT the tubes, it's rarely the tubes) and ran it for a year or so until I put in the larger 3 inch HX which your engine should already have.  I knew NOTHING about diesel engines.  I read a LOT, with no one to ask questions of.

I learned with time, just about the time the internet got started.  And you already have a wealth of information at your fingertips.

If you're a C34IA member, those same tech notes are all available to you.  $25 a year.

Go have at it, it's all there for you.

To paraphrase Ron Hill, it's all there, but you have to read it.

[KWKloeber]

sophie,

What year is the XP?

Hx inspection and cleaning - (pressure test while it's out)

A complete hose change out would be good insurance, and if you need a new belt, I'd recommend a Dayco brand "Top Cog" belt -- it's the best one for our engines (JTSO).

Seawater pump - do you have the Ob or Sherwood?

Engine mounts - check for oil on them (deteriorates them), vibration/movement, loose lag bolts, loose studs/nuts, consider changing them to Vetus 75s.

Vibration might be the cutlass, check it for shaft movement.

Repack the stuffin' box as a PM

Exhaust - inspect riser and aqualift (presume you still have that muffler.)  It's know to leak at the seams over time -- and the riser will be rotting out (sooner or later) at the injection elbow.  Consider upgrading the exhaust. How about the hose? OEM?  probably getting time for a new one.  And all fuel lines as well - including deck fill hose and vent hose.

Battery cables are likely too light (OEM was undersized)

I'm not really a transmission person, beyond checking cable/linkage to make making sure all is free and adjusting so the swing is within spec.

Check out www.realitycheck.me (C36) -- an XP is an XP, no matter which boat it's in.

Are you planning to/able to do a lot of this yourself to stretch dollars?

So far it's all been engine-related, not even getting in to the B.O.A.T. itself. Isn't ownership fun?

ken

[anon]

Thank you Stu, Ken.
I have only had the boat for little more than 3 months and I work long hours, 6 days a week. Therefore my time at the boat has been limited and I wasn't thinking of any kind of trip without getting all the systems fully checked out and upgraded where necessary.
I am a member and have read some of the wiki and tech notes. It is overwhelming. Where do you start? I ask myself.
I have said in earlier posts that I am having the boat hauled next Spring, getting the mast un-stepped and painted, checking the keel wood and bolts and replacing all the thru hulls.
My question about the engine yesterday was because that was something I thought I could make a start on while the boat is in dock and when I am visiting once a week.
I love all the articles in wiki and tech notes but I don't want to miss a trick which is why I was hoping for said idiot's guide to self-inspecting the engine, fuel system and exhaust.
I will take lots of pictures this Saturday when I am there. And I will search the site for engine articles of course.
Thanks again guys.

[Stu Jackson]

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Where do you start? I ask myself.
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Sophie,

That's a very good, even critical, question.

It is also why I wrote the "Quick Start" sticky topic eight years ago.  You are not the first to ask this question.  You're right, we have what, at first glance, appears to be an overwhelming amount of information.  The reason is we KEEP all the important stuff.    Unlike other boating forums which are only "ask & answer" things, like old bulletin boards, our forum and the entire website is searchable.  However, what are very important for starters are the Critical Upgrades, the "101 Topics," the Tech Notes and the wiki.

From the Quick Start:

The REASON for recommending these "reads" is that if you do take a moment to read these "highlights" you may begin to remember having seen any number of important items and can investigate the details later on your own as you needed them, and ask specific questions as they may arise for you. 

I estimate it might take maybe a total of all of four hours of your time to read the Table of Contents for the FAQ Page , Projects Page, download and read the Knowledgebase, OR read the Tech wiki contents pages (just click on "C34 Tech wiki" at the top of each page of this Message Board).  It'd be a great start for each of you.

Sophie, these recommendations are no different than suggesting you read the headlines of a newspaper and ONLY then go back and read the articles you are interested in. If you just read the entire first article in the 'paper, it will simply take much longer to get to the rest of the headlines.  So, please, read the headlines first to get a feel for what's here, then you can make your own choices as to what to read on about the details later.

You've done a great job of asking specific questions since you've joined our little band.

[Noah]

@Jon W.
I am saying that after I retire I will only have a very modest stipend.
All my savings will be going toward bringing the boat up to spec. for cruising from NorCal to Costa Rica. (And back).

The "and back" (uphill) part of your journey (if typical conditions for the left coast) could be MUCH more difficult than the trip downhill. I would suggest you make a few voyages down to SoCal (Channel Islands?) or up around the Farrlon Islands AND BACK to shake down you and your boat, before launching into your grand adventure.

[Jim Hardesty]

Sophie,
Keeping up a boat takes a lot of varied skills, none hard to learn but many.  FWIW you may want to look at Don Casey's book "This Old Boat" next time you are near a Barns and Noble.  I've recommended the book here before and I want to say I get no kick-back from the sales.  It's my go-to book on how to start/do boat projects.

https://www.amazon.com/This-Old-Boat-Second-International/dp/0071477942

I hope dreams become adventures.
Jim

[anon]

Thanks again all. I will buy that book. Big shout out to Ken for posting the link to the Reality Check blog. This is really useful for M25 owners.
I am taking this afternoon off and going to the boat. Stand by for a bunch of photos.