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Author Topic: Testing / Replacing Injector  (Read 3123 times)

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britinusa

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #30 on: June 09, 2017, 02:18:39 PM »

Update. As Peggy (SWMBO) said, if you hear different stories from two different doctors, then consider them both.

Read Ron's Injector rebuild article, very helpful, and spoke with a Marine engine mechanic & two guys at the Kubota dealership.

Outcome: Don't mess around! If the Delivery Valve Holder is moved (rotated) then get the Injector pump retuned (rebuilt)

Apparently, moving the DVH in any direction will upset the timing. Which is pretty much what Ron says in his article.

Solution: New Injector pump is $580, but as Ron points out, there is a possibility that the 'New' pump may not fit the 'Old' engine, So rebuilding the pump is the more reliable process.

Notes: If you have to remove the Injector delivery tubes - DO NOT ALLOW THE DELIVERY VALVE HOLDER to rotate! Do what you have to to prevent it moving. The Marine mechanic suggested wedging them in pairs to prevent rotation.

Good news: Rebuilding the Injector Pump & Tuning all three delivery devices to consistent fuel flow is only $350. (Of course, had I been able to leave the delivery tubes in place and just bend them out of the way in order to replace the injectors, then I'd be $350 better off (ok, $350 plus what ever gaskets are needed to replace the injector pump and the air manifold.)

Having a decent Kubota dealer nearby is a huge value and having reliable diesel mechanics within 30 mins of the boat is another. Having folks, like Ron, on this site is huge!

Thanks. Will report progress.

Paul
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Paul & Peggy
1987 C34 Tall Rig Fin Keel - Hull # 463

See you out on the water

Engine:M25XP

britinusa

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #31 on: June 10, 2017, 05:59:33 AM »

Ron, I have read your article (http://www.c34.org/projects/projects-fixing-injection-pump.htm until I can almost memorize it.

Also, looking at the Universal M25-XP manual I can see how the Injection pump is mounted with the 4 bolts.

Before I take it off, is there anything I should do regarding positional rotation of the crank shaft or will the rebuilt pump just drop in and self align with the cams on the Fuel Cam Shaft?

Paul
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Paul & Peggy
1987 C34 Tall Rig Fin Keel - Hull # 463

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Engine:M25XP

britinusa

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #32 on: June 13, 2017, 11:31:43 AM »

Update: Successfully removed the Injection Pump pretty much as Ron described in his Mainsheet Article (In the Tech Wiki)

The pump has been serviced and I'm ready to clean up the engine and replace it.

There is a 'Timing Shim' that sits between the Pump and the engine body. There is no material gasket either above or below the Timing Shim.

On the engine surface, there is a residue of what appears to be a liquid gasket. It's a really thin film that can be scraped off. I have not picked up the Pump from the service company yet, but I'm guessing that there is a similar film on the underside of the pump.

Soooo. Any suggestions on the type of liquid gasket to use on both surfaces of the shim?

Thanks.

Paul
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KWKloeber

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #33 on: June 13, 2017, 11:34:07 AM »

 Paul,

Before you reinstall the pump look for your Kabota engine serial number. It is supposedly stamped into the injection pump land. I've never found mine and I'm not sure I know any  Who has, but if you can find it it's good info to keep in your pocket.
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KWKloeber

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #34 on: June 13, 2017, 11:34:51 AM »

Have you checked the engine service manual for re-install instructions?
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Ron Hill

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #35 on: June 13, 2017, 02:18:36 PM »

Paul : My article should have also describe how I reinstalled it. 

As I recall I didn't use ANY liquid gasket material.  I just reseated the pump on the same seat.  I believe the shims just lifted off .  It never leak any oil after being seated "as is".
I made sure that I reused the same shims so the timing would remain the same!!

I also noted that the engine type and SN # was stamped on the injection pump seat on the engine block. 

A few thoughts
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KWKloeber

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #36 on: June 13, 2017, 03:09:58 PM »

Paul

from the Westerbeke service manual

NOTE FOR REASSEMBLING: Install the injection pump by aligning the control rack with the
indicated positon. Addition or reduction of one shim delays or advances the injection timing by
0.0262 rad. (1.50). Install the injection pump shims after applying thinly a non-drying adhesive.



A "non drying" adhesive.  hmmmmmm I wonder what that could be.
kk
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britinusa

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #37 on: June 13, 2017, 03:46:51 PM »

Ok, Ken, I'm ignorant on what it might be!

Any ideas?

Paul
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Paul & Peggy
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britinusa

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #38 on: June 13, 2017, 03:49:53 PM »

A pic of the top surface of the engine block where the Injector pump sits.
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Engine:M25XP

KWKloeber

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #39 on: June 13, 2017, 07:33:04 PM »

AHHHH and the elusive Kubota serial number.  Put that in the bank!!

Nah, not sure what would be forever not drying adhesive.  Have no idea why it should be non drying anyway.

That's in all the Kb manuals, though -- your Kb guy might have a clue. 

OR find out what they use to make flypaper!!!

kk
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Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
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britinusa

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #40 on: June 14, 2017, 03:48:25 AM »

It's my understanding that area is low pressure, oil drenched, lubrication.

And, not sure if they (Kubota) thought that pump would be serviced more frequently than every 30 years  :D


And not sure what temperature it gets to.

So, as it should not dry, it sounds like a lubricant (although their description is close to Butyl tape - not going there!)

Perhaps Lanocote? - seems to be the solution for everything else :D


Paul
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jmcdonald

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #41 on: June 14, 2017, 06:58:47 AM »

Permatex aviation form-a-gasket is concidered a non hardening gasket sealer. Although,  in my
experience, it comes pretty close  to getting hard after awhile. Any auto parts store carries it.
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Ron Hill

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #42 on: June 14, 2017, 02:57:02 PM »

Guys : If you understand how the injection pump timing is changed, then you'll understand why I elected to rebuild rather than buy a new pump!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would NOT recommend buying a new pump - go for the rebuild. 

As I said the removal and reinstallation of the injection pump is straight FWD - no big deal.  I did it by myself with nothing written and no Web site to ask!!!! 

A few thoughts

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britinusa

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Re: Testing / Replacing Injector
« Reply #43 on: June 14, 2017, 05:38:24 PM »

As mentioned, I went for the rebuild. Got it back from the injector company today, all setup, cleaned up and painted purdy.

Started putting everything together and one of the Air Intake Bolts sheared ... .Geeeez.

I was able to get the stub out using a pair of grips and can get the replacement bolt tomorrow.

Schedule forbids doing much until Monday :( but hopefully all will go well then.

Paul
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1987 C34 Tall Rig Fin Keel - Hull # 463

See you out on the water

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