cushions, in winter, and how much pink to use?

[anaisdog]

do people take their cushions off, in the winter (if you store, of course)?  I have, for two years, under shrink wrap and i'm thinking about not going through the hassle, this year.  Of course, I have to see how water tight my cabin top is, and how good my brand new cloth cover is too.

second, how much "red pop" do you go through, for the water system?  I thought it was only 2 gallons but my beneteau 50 owner had me buy 5.  we only put it, what - in the lines, in the head, in the sump and a little in each holding tank, right?

thanks in advance
becki kain hull 99 1986

[Indian Falls]

One gallon in the raw water is enough.  Drain water from the muffler first.  Remove the hose from the intake seacock. Put pink stuff into a bucket, put hose into pink stuff.  Run engine until bucket is empty, and then run a few seconds but not more than a minute more.  Most of you pink stuff came out the exhaust, but it pushed the water out and has made whatever remains in the muffler harmless.  The only things between the muffler and the seacock is: hose, impellor housing, the heat exchanger and the manifold.  All of these items together can only contain about 1/2gal of fluid.  This has been my yearly regimen for the past 6 winters.

[KWKloeber]

Becki,

Was it 5 gals of -50F (don't use it) or -100F (use it) pink stuff?
Goes in (unless you completely drain and blow out) the potable water lines (though some use cheap vodka for that to avoid taste tainting the lines/tanks), raw water exhaust system (again unless you completely drain it), bilge, thorough pump thru of the head (intake/pump/bowl.)  You have permanent AF as the engine coolant?

RC (Maine Sail) has a great DIY on winterizing and how to to it properly.  I think I say a YouTube vid of his also.


Ken

[anaisdog]

engine is being done by gregory's.  thanks

[mregan]

I would take the cushions home to be safe.  I find the boat being closed all winter it gets kind of musty inside.  I bring my home to be safe.  Maybe leave one small one on this winter as a test.

Not counting the engine, I go through 3-4 gallons.  I leave the boat in the water in the winter so I'm a little more cautious with the thruhulls freezing.  After the holding tank is empty I pour a gallon in it then run the macerator pumps for a bit then shut the seacock then kill the pump.  I figure the hose from the seacock to the pump is now full of antifreeze instead of any left over water.

I usually put a gallon in each water tank and run the sinks until it pink starts coming out.  Do the same thing with the galley and head sinks.  Shut the seacocks, pour 1/2 gallon of pink in each sink.  Open the seacock.  Soon as the sink is empty, i shut the seacock and leave some of the anitfreeze in the drain line.

Also run it through the engine until it comes out the exhaust.  Then i take a rolled up napkin and stick it in the engine seacock and suck up any water in the seacock fitting(the hose has been pulled off already and stuck in the anitfreeze bucket). Once most of the water is out, I pour a little antifreeze in the seacock and put the hose on.

I figure now anything that is attached to a thruhull is now full of antifreeze and I don't have to worry.

[cmainprize]

We normally bring the cushions home, I take them all apart. Wash all covers in home machine and foam in kiddie pool with a mild beach mix, kids love stomping on them to squish water out.   Everything gets put back together and we add bounce sheets inside the covers.  Smells great.  Removing all cushions allows use to leave all lockers open and clean the boat really well before we put it away.

Your boat should have a strainer in the raw water system.  I close the thru hull and start the boat, I dump in three or so gallons in the strainer, it uses this in less then thirty seconds.  I put one gallon directly into the holding tank.  One gallon in the v berth tank.  We have strainer in our lake water system as well, it also feeds the head.  I dump another gallon our two in there and run all the lake water discharges, hot and cold.  Yes, I use lake water in my hot water tank.  Then everything's gets blown out, except the holding tank and engine system. 
We removed the aft tank years ago.

Don't forget the shower and ice box drains.

[Noah]

You folks are a tough and dedicated lot! i thank my lucky stars everyday that I wake up and sail in San Diego.

[Bobg]

I run a gallon of pink stuff thru the engine raw water , and follow up with a gallon of 100 below stuff.  Then when on the hard I open all thru holes, I remove the hoses from the hot water tank install a bypass nipple in, and drain the hot water tank, I know there is some left in but it don't hurt anything.  Then I flush out  the holding tank and remove my 3" inspection port and wash the inside good with a garden hose,and shop vac out the remaining liquid put a gallon of the pink stuff in the toilet and flush it in and  run the macerator.  .  actually 2 years ago I forgot to close the thru hull valve and the tank filled up with water, froze solid but didn't hurt it noticed it in the spring.
I disconnect the hose to the rear tank at the valves and just drain it.  I don't put any pink stuff in the rear tank.  I vacuum out the front tank, put a gallon of pink stuff in it and run the pump until pink comes out the head and galley sinks. pour a little pink in the fridge, and shower drain and run the pump. the cushions I just stand them up and throw a few bounty slips around. The boat is as good a storage shed as any.

A guy in the marina hung some bags in his boat that collected water from the air, don't know what it was but they were full so I know it works

I vacuum the bilge and put some green full strength anti freeze to it to take care of any rain coming down the mast.  One year the bilge was full of ice, don't want that again.
my biggest concern is covering my bright work with something, winter is really hard on it.  any one have any ideas on that?  Painters tape?

[Jim Hardesty]

I cover my boat well, so under the cover it's cold and dry.  Unless I'm doing a lot of work in the boat during the winter I leave the cushions in.  I take the seat backs and put them in the v-berth, then open all the doors, crack the hatches in the head and aft cabin.  I never get any musty or stale smells.  That's for an Erie, PA winter.  May be if your winters are warmer and wetter mold and milldew would be a problem.
The PO added a schreader valve (like a car tire) to the house water just after the pump.  I just put a small compressor on that valve and blow out all the water from the water lines, put a gallon of the pink stuff in the aft water tank (I don't use the fwd tank), use the water pump till the tank is empty, then blow out the pink stuff from all the faucets.  Other than that I winterize like every one else.  If it has had water in it.  Drain it or put in antifreze.
Jim

[mainesail]

I have seen far too many freeze ups and the resulting damage from owners being "frugal" about how much PG they use... D'oh...

This is what Westerbeke recommends.. 5 GALLONS!!!

Westerbeke:

Sea Water Circuit
Close the thru hull seacock. Remove the raw water intake hose from the sea cock. Place the end of this hose into a 5-gallon bucket of clean fresh water. Before starting the engine, check the zinc pencil found in the primary heat exchanger on the engine and clean or replace it, if required. Clean your sea strainer, if one is installed in the inside of the hull.

Start the engine and allow the raw water pump to draw the fresh water through the system. When the bucket empties, stop the engine and refill the bucket with an antifreeze solution slightly stronger than needed for winter freeze protection in your area.

Start the engine and allow all of this mixture to be drawn through the raw water system. Once the bucket empties, stop the engine. This anti-freeze mixture should protect your raw water circuit from freezing during winter lay-up, as well as providing corrosion protection.

FILL THE BUCKET WITH ANTIFREEZE... Remember this is a 5 gallon bucket they spell out and tell you to FILL....

If you have a Sea Frost or other engine driven circuit in the RW intake line it may take more.

The best way to know, and not use excess PG, is to sample the exhaust at the end of each gallon. Test it with a sight refractometer and it should match the concentration of a new bottle. I have large power boats that take as much as 16 gallons per engine!!! Do I test it? You bet I do because it starts getting really expensive when you have two engines taking a combined 32 gallons of AF. Wanna know what is more expensive? Freezing a huge Cat, Yanmar, Cummins, Mann etc........  I am doing a Ford Lehman in a Grand Banks tomorrow that takes 12 gallons.

Last spring alone I replaced an HX on a M-25 that froze and split the tube pack and one on a Westerbeke W-30. I still have both HX's in my shop waiting to go to the scrap yard for copper price..

One owner had sucked in two gallons of -50 and one just until he "saw pink"..... Those repairs, like many others I have done, cost them a LOT more than an additional two or three gallons of PG.

Test it or do what Westerbeke recommends or be "frugal" and have it eventually bite you in the butt.

[patrice]

HI,

For my part, the cushions remain in the boat.
I place them all up side ways, like little tent.
This prevent moisture building under them, and leave a good aeration possible.

I've been doing this all the years and never had issues.

For the anti-freeze part, like all previous post.

[Stu Jackson]

From the "101 Topics" sticky

Winterizing an Engine on the Hard (Thanks to Maine Sail) - NEVER connect a hose to your raw water pump inlet - NEVER!!!

http://forums.catalina.sailboatowners.com/showthread.php?p=873073&highlight=winterizing

[KWKloeber]

I have seen far too many freeze ups and the resulting damage from owners being "frugal" about how much PG they use... D'oh...

This is what Westerbeke recommends.. 5 GALLONS!!!

RC,

Note that becki was talking about winterizing other than the engine, which is being taken care of separately. 
Perhaps the Beneteau 50 owner was confused and thinking the 5 gals was for the engine?

Ken

[KWKloeber]

Might be of interest:

Download the New Online Winterizing Guide from BoatUS
http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/winter/winterizing.pdf

Download the all new, 16-page Seaworthy Boater's Guide to Winterizing, you'll find the list of items that would have prevented more than 95 percent of the freeze claims handled by the BoatUS Marine Insurance Program in the past decade.
http://www.boatus.com/seaworthy/winter/winterworksheet.pdf

KK

[mainesail]

RC,

Note that becki was talking about winterizing other than the engine, which is being taken care of separately.  
Perhaps the Beneteau 50 owner was confused and thinking the 5 gals was for the engine?

Ken

I was just responding in general not to anyone in particular... Sorry for teh confusion..

Almost every spring I do thousands of dollars in repairs because of incorrect or inadequate winterizing practices. It was just a word of caution...