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Author Topic: Keel bolt socket  (Read 4756 times)

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Indian Falls

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Keel bolt socket
« on: April 29, 2014, 08:01:05 PM »

Since I needed a keel bolt socket when I re-bedded my keel.  I had to make one.
Last year a forum member really needed a socket so for a few bucks I sent him mine... I'll just make another one.
The first one was 10'' long and was a $9.00 1-1/8'' six point deep well, laser cut in half with a tube mig welded between.
It won't win any awards but it couldn't be broken and fit all the bolt positions.

I made a second one after putting a bit of grey matter into it, to make an improvement or two.
The laser cut is stepped and the tube between is cut to fit almost so tight you don't need to weld it.
It's laser welded just so the parts don't loosen and fall apart with a few uses. 
The torque load is on the physical connection not the weld and shall never break.
If anyone needs a socket..... for the cost of material and a six pack, I can help you out. 
Just email my link here on the forum. 
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Dan & Dar
s/v Resolution, 1990 C34 997
We have enough youth: how about a fountain of "smart"?

Noah

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2014, 09:07:55 PM »

Regarding tightening the keel bolts: would you consider this a "normal" maintenance task, or something to do ONLY if you see symptoms, such as an exaggerated "smile" or, cracking, or hit something? If no symptoms, should one just leave well enough alone?
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1990 hull #1014, San Diego, CA,  Fin Keel,
Standard Rig

Ken Juul

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #2 on: April 30, 2014, 06:07:02 AM »

It is something that can only be done on the hard.  A 10-20 minute job, once you have the socket or access to one. I check them every time I'm out.  First check at about 12-15 years old they were quit loose.  Subsequent checks don't get much movement, but some.
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Ken & Vicki Juul
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Chesapeake Bay
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patrice

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2014, 07:28:01 AM »

Hi,

Nice job   :clap

I just bought a socket at a store nearby, and was going to have it cut and extended by a co-worker.
In the Wiki they mention about 4-5in. extension, and your talking about 10in.
Should I go that long, is it to make it easier with the torque handle.

Thanks.
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_____________
Patrice
1989 MKI #970
TR, WK, M25XP
   _/)  Free Spirit
 ~~~~~~

Indian Falls

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2014, 03:50:15 PM »

Patrice, Noahr ( is that No Air?  No ahr?)

It won't matter as long as the threaded rods are less than your socket.  10'' socket and a 6" extension gets the
torque wrench up nice and comfortable, plus allows use of it in the door opening for the water heater.

I check my bolts every year before splash, and every time I even think the keel came in contact with a sandbar
or other fixed object.  Low water and sand bars are a common problem in Wilson Harbor NY.
Despite other opinions, there is no reason you cannot check or tighten them in the water, it just don't matter...
Have a look at the math involved, you don't have to believe me.

When I first got my socket on board and checked my bolts, my first thought was that they had NEVER been checked.
I got nearly a full turn on all of them.
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Dan & Dar
s/v Resolution, 1990 C34 997
We have enough youth: how about a fountain of "smart"?

Noah

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2014, 04:55:07 PM »

It's Noah Rosenblatt. And thanks for the info. Although there are no visible cracks, dry bilge, and very small smile, etc. Based on the other stuff I inherited (old wiring harness, old sink drains, fuel screen, etc.) I must assume the bolts have never been re-tightened.
I will add it to my list!
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1990 hull #1014, San Diego, CA,  Fin Keel,
Standard Rig

Clay Greene

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2014, 12:36:28 PM »

Very impressive engineering.  For the liberal arts graduates, you can buy a keel bolt socket that works:

http://www.toolbarn.com/grey-pneumatic-2048xd.html

The first time we used it, the nut on the keel bolt farthest forward was loose - I could have spun it off with my hand.  I got a couple of turns on two others. 

It's easy to do when the boat is out of the water.  I consider it to be an annual maintenance thing. 
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1989, Hull #873, "Serendipity," M25XP, Milwaukee, Wisconsin

Roland Gendreau

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2014, 01:02:40 PM »

I purchased my socket on Amazon for a bit less:

http://www.amazon.com/Sunex-2-Inch-8-Inch-Impact-Socket/dp/B002YKK7X4
 


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Roland Gendreau
1992 MK 1.5
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Bristol, RI

Indian Falls

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2014, 01:38:50 PM »

The tool barn one is only 5" long.  That may be fine for the mark II  but the threads above the nut in my Mark 1.5 are longer than 5''
I cannot tell how long the Sunex socket is. 

The whole idea of making a 10" socket was to avoid buying a $20.00 1/2 drive 10'' or 12'' extension. 
If your socket is 5 and you have a 6'' extension that usually comes with a 1/2'' socket set... 
your torque wrench is on the floor, and you cant use it in the hot water tank door, which means you'll be using a swivel or some more extensions.
I'm here to help!   
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Dan & Dar
s/v Resolution, 1990 C34 997
We have enough youth: how about a fountain of "smart"?

Clay Greene

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2014, 02:22:40 PM »

The Toolbarn socket worked fine on our 1989 C34, very definitely a Mark I boat.  But you raise a good point to measure the height of the bolts to make sure that whatever socket you buy or make will fit.  For whatever reason, there is variation between the boats in terms of the height that the bolts extend up above the bilge floor. 
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1989, Hull #873, "Serendipity," M25XP, Milwaukee, Wisconsin

Stu Jackson

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #10 on: May 01, 2014, 05:19:43 PM »

The first time we used it, the nut on the keel bolt farthest forward was loose - I could have spun it off with my hand.  I got a couple of turns on two others. 

Kinda indirectly leads to the following conlusion:

GO CHECK your keel bolts BY HAND.  Don't wait to buy a socket or make one ala Dan.

If they turn by hand, guess what?!?   :shock:

You'll just get or borrow one a lot sooner.  :D
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite"  Cowichan Bay, BC  Maple Bay Marina  SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)

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Roland Gendreau

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2014, 06:19:00 AM »

The Sunex socket purchased through Amazon is 5 inches long.  It was long enough for the bolts on my Mark 1.5
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Roland Gendreau
1992 MK 1.5
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Bristol, RI

Phil Spicer

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2014, 08:23:02 AM »

   Some of my keel bolt nuts are coated part way up with gelcoat and/or epoxy. Should I just chip the epoxy/gelcoat away so I can get a socket on the nut?
   One good thing, so far I have no Catalina smile.
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Phil & Marsha Spicer-Dock at Sandusky Sailing Club-
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Steamboat is #789 Tall Rig-Wing Keel-Our picture is what we see from our dock which is a view of Cedar Point Amusement Park"The Roller Coast

Indian Falls

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Re: Keel bolt socket
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2014, 02:19:47 PM »

I exaggerated my keel stud length a bit. My apologies!
 I am on the boat today and they are between 3 and 4 inches. 

But, a nice tall socket works really well with an ordinary 6'' extension.

About the gelcoat slopped up on the nuts... I'd just tap the socket down til that stuff chips off. 
Dont tighten unless you engage the nut all the way.

About that math I mentioned earlier in this post...  one ordinary 7/8-9 stainless bolt at a max suggested torque of 190ft/lbs creates a clamp load of over 12,000 lbs.  Two keels could be suspended with only one bolt.
So if we are at 105-107 ft lbs, you still have over10x the lifting capacity needed to hold your keel onto the keel stub.
As far as wondering what ft/lbs....  I would go with the lesser 105.  You are really crushing the fiberglass at 100ft/lbs.
There again the weight of your keel whether hanging or boat sitting on it compared to the clamp pressure of one keel bolt  is insignificant at less than 10% of the clamp load. Where the difference between 105 and 107 is nearly the same difference of just over 400lbs .   This is why it is my opinion you can tighten your keel bolts in the water or on the hard.

I would like to know what the rationale is for not torquing them in the water.. I've only read that you can't and no substantiation for it. 

Thanks for reading all that!
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Dan & Dar
s/v Resolution, 1990 C34 997
We have enough youth: how about a fountain of "smart"?
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