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Author Topic: Oil pan, early MKII's  (Read 3483 times)

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reedbr

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Oil pan, early MKII's
« on: June 19, 2013, 01:26:25 PM »

I had an oil pressure alarm on my boat a few weeks ago. First I want to say thanks to those who gave me advice here, and especially to Ron who picked up the phone to help work out a solution. I think my problem is solved, but I still need help for a permanent solution on one item. Also, I did five things at once so I have no idea what my specific solution was, or if maybe my problem is just lurking to surface later. The alarm was intermittent at the time.

I need help on a permanent solution for #4.

What I did:
(1) Replaced the oil pressure sensor. It is a $15 part and is right behind the oil filter on my M35B. The connections were a little corroded when I took the old one off.
(2) Replaced the Sherwood raw water pump. This is probably unrelated, but it was weeping water through the weep holes and leaking oil where it attaches to the gear case. $370 at Engines1 in Norfolk, plus $3 for the gasket that is not included.
(3) Drained the oil and sent to to Blackstone Labs in Fort Wayne, Indiana. For $25 a sample, they read the tea leaves and told me that for the hours on the oil (9 on the recent sample, 50 on last fall's oil change sample) I had high iron content. I talked with Ron about this and we determined that my oil changes were incomplete. I was only getting 2-1/2 quarts out plus whatever was in the filter, and this should be a 4 quart engine.
(4) I took a closer look at my oil pan factory drain hose and realized the drain was in the bottom FRONT of the pan, not the back. When the engine is mounted at an angle, this matters. I removed the dipstick mount which is in the middle and wiggled a hose to the back and removed another almost two quarts.
(5) Put in new oil and a new filter.

I ran it about 7 hours on a trip last weekend and I did not have any issues. On the trip I rafted up to a 2005 C34 owned by my friend Jeff. Jeff showed me his engine, also an M35B, and his drain hose is attached to the back side of the pan, much lower than mine. His dipstick was mounted differently too. Basically, the oil pan was completely different.

So my question is, how do I get a lower drain hole for my oil pan? Is there enough space to drop the pan without raising the engine? Can I remount the factory drain hose lower in the pan? Should I just buy a new oil pan? And, how many years was production like this? MkII's started in 96 and mine is a 97, hull #1365. I assume I am not the only one.

I have a couple pictures. Can I post them directly here or do I have to host them somewhere else?
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Brian Reed
1997 C34 mkII "Ambitious"
St. Mary's River, MD

ozzie

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #1 on: June 19, 2013, 02:08:55 PM »

I have been using a vacuum fluid extraction pump to do my oil changes thru the dip stick hole. Cheaper and less hassle than changing the oil pan. It can take a while to remove the oil but there is very little mess and easy to read how much oil was removed.

 http://www.defender.com/product.jsp?path=-1|10918|314179&id=1298219
 
 
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Ron Hill

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #2 on: June 19, 2013, 02:45:57 PM »

Brian : The First Mk II was in 1995 and I believe was hull #1250.

I have heard that some have removed the oil pan from a M25XP (3 cylinder) without removing the engine.  I suspect that with your 4 cylinder that you can't remove the oil pan without at least lifting the engine.  That extra cylinder goes back too far.

I apologize, as I thought that all M35BC engines had the oil drain in the rear of the oil pan!!  You need to talk to Westerbeke and ask if your earlier engine can even accept the newer aft drain oil pan? 

I can't help on how to remove most of the old oil (99.5%) out without that rear oil pan drain.

A few thoughts 
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Ron, Apache #788

reedbr

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #3 on: June 19, 2013, 02:51:17 PM »

Here are the pictures.

Pic1 is the front of the engine, I circled the drain hose on the front of the pan and the dipstick tube coming out the side of the pan.

Pic2 is the oil pressure sensor with the oil filter removed. Note if you want to put a guage in, it looks like there is a second npt threaded port to hook into, just remove the plug.

Pic3 is a poor angled shot, but this is the starboard side of the pan where the dipstick tube attaches in the middle. I removed this whole tube to insert a hose right into the side of the pan to get more oil out. I don't want to do that every time though. I was not able to get a tube down the dipstick tube without removing it. it got hung up on something.

Thanks Tony for the help on picture posts. That is much easier.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2013, 06:44:05 AM by reedbr »
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Brian Reed
1997 C34 mkII "Ambitious"
St. Mary's River, MD

TonyP

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #4 on: June 19, 2013, 03:13:34 PM »

Brian

Below the typing window there is this

Attach: (Choose File)    (more attachments)
Allowed file types: txt, doc, pdf, jpg, gif, mpg, png
Maximum attachment size allowed: 150 KB, per post: 5

Click the choose file and select the one you want less than the max file size.
You may have to resize it first

Good luck with your engine
cheers
Tony
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Tony Plunkett
C34 Moonshadow
1992  Hull#1174
Pittwater / Newport
NSW Australia

Stu Jackson

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #5 on: June 19, 2013, 05:42:38 PM »

From the "101 Topics" sticky

Posting Photos 101  http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,3701.0.html
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite"  Cowichan Bay, BC  Maple Bay Marina  SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)

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cmainprize

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2013, 09:13:52 AM »

Hi Brian, like you I have considered figuring out a way to get my oil drain to the rear of the pan. Checking marine deisel direct the price of the 35B oil pan is $450, so that won't be an option for me unless I could source the kubota equivelent for much less.  I think the easier solution would be to drop the pan (looks like there is enough room) and have a new fitting brazed on and to plug the old hole.

I am going to look at this option when we lay up the boat for the winter.
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Cory Mainnprize
Mystic
Hull # 1344
M35
Midland Ontario

reedbr

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2013, 01:52:27 PM »

Wow, I hadn't looked that part up yet. It is pricey.

Your winter starts before mine. Make sure you let me know if that pan will come off or not without jacking the motor. I agree it looks like there might be enough room, depending on how low the rods and pickup tube go.

I found this, almost all the way down it notes "just enough clearance for the pan":
http://www.c34.org/projects/queimada/m25xp/

I found this kubota engine naming convention, which my best guess might put the M35B as a Kubota V1305:
http://www.kubotaengine.com/products/engines/engine-model-name-identification
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Brian Reed
1997 C34 mkII "Ambitious"
St. Mary's River, MD

Mike and Joanne Stimmler

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2013, 12:33:36 PM »

I believe I posted the easy solution to this problem awhile back and that was to buy a case of beer, invite all your friends over to the boat and have them all stand on or near the bow to get the required tilt of the oil pan to get the last bit of oil out. Problem solved   :clap

Mike
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Mike and Joanne Stimmler
Former owner of Calerpitter
'89 Tall Rig Fin keel #940
San Diego/Mission Bay
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reedbr

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2013, 03:17:20 PM »

That's a lot of friends/beer.

For a Kubota interchange on the M35B, research so far points to the 05 series engine, V1305 which looks like it comes in a Kubota F3060 mower and B2710 tractor. This is a best guess so far. I'm not sure how to verify.
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Brian Reed
1997 C34 mkII "Ambitious"
St. Mary's River, MD

Ron Hill

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2013, 04:55:31 PM »

Brian : You need to look at these Kubota oil pans because there is NO guarantee that it isn't a special pan (with drain in the rear) that Kubota only puts on Westerbeke engines!!  A thought
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Ron, Apache #788

Ralph Masters

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #11 on: June 26, 2013, 08:09:07 AM »

Mike,
You are a genius.  My next oil change, you are invited.

Ralph
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Ralph Masters
Ciao Bella
San Diego
Hull 367, 1987

Mike and Joanne Stimmler

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Re: Oil pan, early MKII's
« Reply #12 on: June 26, 2013, 10:29:52 AM »

I'll be there Ralph, I always need a good excuse to get out of Phoenix.

Mike
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Mike and Joanne Stimmler
Former owner of Calerpitter
'89 Tall Rig Fin keel #940
San Diego/Mission Bay
mjstimmler@cox.net
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