What would you take off to acquire a 1990 C34 with a few issues

[Fred Koehlmann]

The reason most of us bought sailboats, was to go sailing. Unless you have a very long season, lots of spare time, prefer projects to sailing, or are tight on cash, why go with a boat that will be more work than "fun"? I agree with the cautious crowd. There are other boats out there, ... and maybe think about a MkII wing keel,... they're sweet!

My 2 (CAN) cents!

[Stu Jackson]

Let's say you have two choices:

1.  This boat for say, even, $30K.  Add in the cost to refurbish and repair it, another $30K.  Let's even forget about the value of your labor effort.

2.  Another boat, maybe even newer, that costs $anywhere from $50 to $60K.

Most every boating forum I have read (and I "do" a lot of them) recommends that unless you have repairs, refurbishment and LOTS of time on your hands as a PLAN in your LIFE, AND a TREMENDOUS desire or reason to do so (love of the particular boat class, commitment, it was your father's old boat...), you are most likely making a BIG mistake by buying a fixer-upper and thinking you'll save money.

It just doesn't work like that.

Most of us who have bought anywhere from good to very good to pristine previously owned boats will attest to two things:

1.  There's always gonna be something to "do"

2.  It's a boat: it WILL take TWICE as long as you thought to do whatever it is

Our boat was in pristine shape when we bought her in 1998.  The 1986 boat had a 1957 electrical system.  The first thing I did was replace the old charger, which was killing the batteries, and install a modern system.  Then, and only then, could I take the boat out and anchor overnight.  And even if I was a marina hopper, I couldn't keep the boat plugged in with the old charger.

Please, please, please, do your "homework."

Good luck.

[Stephen Butler]

The deciding issue in our minds was the available time required to repair or replace a new vs older boat.  We have known owners of new boats and old boats and they all share the common challenge of maintenance and repair...and whether to DIY or have the yard do it.  Many years ago we started to keep track of time spent sailing vs time spent working....and stopped as the ratio was simply too sided...almost 4 hours of upkeep to 1 hour of actual sail time.  We have come to the conclusion that one can either buy old and repair/replace, or one can purchase new/newer and repair/replace.....it just comes down to how much time you have and the corresponding amount of money you have to purchase someone else's time if you are short.  Just another opinion.

[Kyle Ewing]

RonE--You might do a search on "keel swap" here in case the otherwise perfect fin keel boat comes along.  Years ago there were some threads regarding trading keels.  One of the posts references Marskeel (http://www.marskeel.com/keels/10) which seams to be the manufacturer of Catalina keels, or you can contact the factory. 

There's a post on rebedding the keel (http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,6842.0.html) which'll give you an idea of how difficult it is once you get the keel.

[Clay Greene]

I did a quick Yachtworld search and found three 90-91 C34s for sale in New Jersey, Maryland and Virginia.  One of them may be the boat you are looking at but that means there are at least two alternatives relatively close to you that I would wager are in better condition than what you describe.

[RonE]

Well I thought the Cape Dory forum was good(CD27), but the catalina forum is even
better. Thanks for all the informative responses
I walked away from the C34 in Barnegat today, I never even completed the survey.
The owner was very difficult, and among other things didn't want to go any lower then
43000.
I looked at a couple of C36 MK1.5's today in Maryland, one was in Baltimore and the other
in Harve De Grace. I like the 90 in Baltimore more so, but both boats had some issues.
There are no C34 MK1.5's with a wing keel from Maryland to Maine, other then the one in
Barnegat, and the one  in Jersey city is an earlier 90 model, lacking the open transom, the
boat was quite neglected any how.
I have a budget of 50000, I like the open transom, and the more powerful deisel,
and also like the way they left some outside teak on the MK1.5. I am going to look at 1993 C36
that is coming into Marblehead tomorrow. It has a 40hp Yanmar. Although the broker was telling me
today that the mast step in the keel was just repaired.
There is also a 90 C36 that just came into Annapolis from Georgetown and may check it on
Thursday. Other then that if I want a Catalina this summer I may have go pre 1990.
Ron

[Stu Jackson]

Oh, gosh, NO!  A pre-90 Catalina.

It'll sink on ya!

Don't go there!!!

Too dangerous...

If you're just looking for a boat in our size of Catalinas, that's fine.

Recognize, however, that as great a boat as a C36 is, the C34 V berth is MUCH larger, and, as you know, the entire saloon is major different.

Happy hunting.

[RonE]

Hey Stu...
I like the 34..
Trying to keep my old lady comfy and happy.
The V-berth is the first thing she commented on when she came down the companion way..
I originally like the 34 idea, because the size looked a little bit easier to handle single handed+
my partner.
My dock neighbor has a C36 MKII, he seems very intimidated to sail short handed.
I sailed a few times on it and spent over a week sailing to Block Is and a round L.I.
the boat cruised nice, although we motored a lot.
Is the Fin keel as stiff in a breeze as a wing keel?
What speed can you motor at with a 23hp diesel?
Looking at these boats for the last month or so, I beginning to think what matters most,
is not a fin, wing, MK1, MK1.5, a 23HP, 25HP, a 30HP or even a 40 yanmar, but which one
was well maintained, upgraded and clean. I can't believe some of the crap I have seen
personally or in photos, I me dirty laundry, pee stains, duct tape on ports, what the hell are
sellers thinking. I looked at an Island Packet next to this C36 in Maryland, and you could eat
off the floor immaculate, thats what I want. I rather buy and older well manicured boat with
in my budget then to spend 69000 that needs TLC, give me a damn break already.. 
Ron

[Mike and Joanne Stimmler]

Hi Ron,
If you compare the specs of the c34 and the c36, you will find that they are not that much different in size and I would not let the size of the c36 scare you or your wife. You should decide which floor plan you like the most and go from there. If you like them both, then that just gives you that many more boats to choose from. I'm sure you'll find something you like.

Mike

[Stu Jackson]

Hey Stu...
1.  I like the 34..

2.  My dock neighbor has a C36 MKII, he seems very intimidated to sail short handed.

3.  Is the Fin keel as stiff in a breeze as a wing keel?

4.  What speed can you motor at with a 23hp diesel?

5.  Looking at these boats for the last month or so, I beginning to think what matters most,
is not a fin, wing, MK1, MK1.5, a 23HP, 25HP, a 30HP or even a 40 yanmar, but which one
was well maintained, upgraded and clean. I can't believe some of the crap I have seen
personally or in photos, I me dirty laundry, pee stains, duct tape on ports, what the hell are
sellers thinking. I looked at an Island Packet next to this C36 in Maryland, and you could eat
off the floor immaculate, thats what I want. I rather buy and older well manicured boat with
in my budget then to spend 69000 that needs TLC, ...

1.  Good, very good. 

2.  That's really his issue.  Mike's right, the boats are essentially the same.  There's a very good single handed topic which recommends midships spring lines if your dock has cleats.  Check out the "101 Topics" for that.  So many of us single hand our boats.  It's fun.

3.  Keels:  shallower keels are heavier, therefore, stiffness is essentially the same.

4.  Motoring speed:  My 21 hp M25 does just fine here in our currents.  I do six knots at 2450 to 2650 rpm.  Yes, some folks like the larger engines for bucking headwinds, and it's true, they would do better than a smaller engine, but for "regular" use, it's not an issue, least it hasn't been for me.  Someone once made the point that a smaller engine gives you more space for working on it! 

5.  Now you got it!

You might want to talk to some folks in Barnegat Bay and see what keels they have.  We used to have a C34 Fleet there at one time.  You could also sign up for the C36 Forum (free, like here) and ask there, too.  www.c36ia.org    In looking at the chart for Barnegat Bay, it seems that there are a few deeper water courses through the Bay, but a lot of pretty thin water elsewhere.  Once you get into a boat as big as a C34 or C36, you wouldn't be thinking about gunkholing around like say a C22 or C25 with a swing keel (or a 4 foot deep C25 fixed keel) would anyway, would you?  Don't know.  All I'm thinking is that the wing keel would make a lot more difference in Florida where ALL the water is thin, and maybe the ICW but folks have done it with fin keels (5'-7"  say nominal 6 foot).

Good luck, we hear ya about neglect - it's a sad state of affairs, but many of us have been there, done that - I looked for over a year and saw some stuff that made me want to just sit down and cry.

[Footloose]

Ron,

I hear your frustration and relate to the poor upkeep of many boats.  Like Stu, I looked for over a year before I had my current boat almost fall into my lap.  I was ready to give up on looking for the summer and sail our Bristol 27 and resume looking in the fall.  One last look at Yachtworld revealed what is now our C34 sitting on the hard about 50 feet form our boat. It had just come up for sale.  I looked at it that night and was all over it, like a rash.  When you least expect it the right one will show up.  Hang in there, it will be worth it in the end.

[RonE]

Looks like a nice boat down in New Bern, North Carolina, the 'Mary Gee' for sale.
Does any one know of the boat or happen live near by.
thanks,
Ron

[Steve Sayian]

Ron,

I just checked Yachtworld.com and selected the entire East Coast for 1990-2003 C-34 and found about 20 that are out there around your price range.

Steve

[Stephen Butler]

When we went shopping for our boat, we looked at all makes and models and for awhile, seriously considered C36s...the broker pointed out that the C36 and C34 were roughly the same size, etc., etc.   The broker was generally correct, but after doing some more research, we found that the BIG difference was the v-berth size and the location and size of the head.  For us, these became critical live-aboard comfort issues. And yes, we have a fin keel and sail in Florida's thin waters, but manage to stay off the bottom.   Realize how challenging it may be to locate a reasonable C34, but it is certainly worth the effort.  Just an opinion. 

[kevMar]

WOW Stu
       I have one of those PRE 1990 34 Catalinas...  The boat made it through Hurricane Irene without sinking and it did not even leak !!!  and not one scratch on her....I just may have one of the better PRE 1990 Catalinas ......