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Author Topic: Keyed Ignition  (Read 231 times)

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crieders

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Keyed Ignition
« on: June 20, 2022, 07:10:24 AM »

While on a lovely Father’s Day Sail in the Chesapeake, I managed to shear the key in the ignition switch with the engine off  while still sailing  in 21 knot  plus winds. my son removed the instrument panel and I jump started the engine. With the key still in the ignition, I thought of just replacing it with new 3 position switch from West.  Anything special I should know about what to use or how to do it?
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Cliff Rieders, c34 tall rig, 1990, hull #1022

Kyle Ewing

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #1 on: June 20, 2022, 07:31:11 AM »

I replaced mine (1990 #1010) a few seasons ago with a Cole Hersee Ignition Switch CH 95612 (no key) and have been happy with it.  I don't remember anything difficult about replacing it. 

See this thread (https://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5799.msg81689.html#msg81689) for how others have addressed the situation and a picture of my switch.
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Kyle Ewing
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Belmont Harbor, Chicago
http://www.saildonnybrook.com/

crieders

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #2 on: June 20, 2022, 08:44:57 AM »

Thank you for the ideas. Does the single white lead go to ignition and the four other wires to power? My wife had an interesting idea about my building a cover over the instrument panel which could easily be hinged or just removed when the boat is in use, to protect from the elements and careless people like me who stepped on the key as I navigated from the deck to the pulpit seat while my son was at the helm
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Cliff Rieders, c34 tall rig, 1990, hull #1022

KWKloeber

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #3 on: June 20, 2022, 10:02:07 AM »

Cliff

I don't know how your panel is set up.
If you use the key to preheat, not start, (and don't have a preheat solenoid) make sure you get the switch that is rated high amps in the “start” position.

I ground down my key so that I can grab it but it's too short to step on and hurt it.
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Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
So throw off the bowlines.  Sail away from the safe harbor.  Catch the tradewinds in your sails.
Explore.  Dream.  Discover.   -Mark Twain

Noah

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #4 on: June 20, 2022, 10:07:29 AM »

I had that happen to me under not so critical wind condition but still resulted in a long windward “tacking dual” in Bay traffic (with very nervous passenger aboard) until I got it sorted. Bottomline is:
1. Ended up extracting the key by epoxying the broken piece to the piece still stuck in the ignition switch and then pulled key out (luckly)
2. Had set of new sturdier keys made. The key blanks that come with switch are “light pot metal”
3. Now I take the key out when I shut off the engine and sailing, but keep it in the cup holder close by. A little controversial, but as long as all aboard know where it is, it works for me.
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 10:13:03 AM by Noah »
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1990 hull #1014, San Diego, CA,  Fin Keel,
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KWKloeber

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #5 on: June 20, 2022, 10:18:42 AM »

I don't have a picture handy but the Westerbeke and other panels are deep enough that the key fits/sits behind the plexi. There's a circular hole cut for the key way, which has a teardrop shaped cover on a small pivot bolt that hangs over the hole.  Slide the cover aside for key access.

I forgot to mention if you don't have one on it now, to get the cole hersee weather tight cover for the new key switch.
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Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
So throw off the bowlines.  Sail away from the safe harbor.  Catch the tradewinds in your sails.
Explore.  Dream.  Discover.   -Mark Twain

Stu Jackson

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #6 on: June 20, 2022, 10:37:32 AM »

My Tech Note on key switch replacement:

https://c34.org/Ignition-Key-Switch-Replacement/
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite"  Cowichan Bay, BC  Maple Bay Marina  SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)

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Ron Hill

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #7 on: June 20, 2022, 02:55:44 PM »

Cliff : Go to Defender and buy a Cole Hersee 3 position key switch.  I'm surprised that you original switch has lasted that long!!  Then get rubber boots for that switch (may come with it ?) and another rubber boot for the starter switch.

I've written Mainsheet tech note articles (with pictures) on replacing the switches and how to build a new plexiglass cover, and install a sunbrella a cover over that instrument panel!!

A few thoughts
« Last Edit: June 20, 2022, 02:57:29 PM by Ron Hill »
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crieders

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2022, 09:30:36 AM »

high amp in the starting position. I never considered that
i did order the cole hersee M-712BP which i see is a 4 position switch
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Cliff Rieders, c34 tall rig, 1990, hull #1022

crieders

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #9 on: June 22, 2022, 09:36:36 AM »

the Cole Hersee
i see it says 5 amp in starting position
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Cliff Rieders, c34 tall rig, 1990, hull #1022

Ron Hill

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #10 on: June 22, 2022, 03:00:32 PM »

Cliff : What you needed is the Cole Hersee #M-550-14BP.  It comes with the rubber protective boot and is 3 position = 1. Off; 2. ON (Fuel Pump); 3. spring loaded (Glow Plugs) !!!

I have NO idea what you are going to do with or how you'll wire the 4th position!!  Just send it back and get the 3 position switch - which is what you had!!  :shock:

A thought
« Last Edit: June 22, 2022, 03:13:06 PM by Ron Hill »
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Stu Jackson

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #11 on: June 22, 2022, 06:02:20 PM »

Cliff : What you needed is the Cole Hersee #M-550-14BP.  It comes with the rubber protective boot and is 3 position = 1. Off; 2. ON (Fuel Pump); 3. spring loaded (Glow Plugs) !!!

...

Hull #1022 is most likely a Mark I or 1 1/2, which would infer that it has a cockpit panel with a separate glow plug button, thus only requiring a two position key switch.  The model I included in my linked tech note in my last post is 2 position, the text covers it, no boot though.  I have a plexiglass cover and a Sunbrella cover over that.
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite"  Cowichan Bay, BC  Maple Bay Marina  SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)

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KWKloeber

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #12 on: June 22, 2022, 06:04:32 PM »

the Cole Hersee
i see it says 5 amp in starting position

Cliff

Do a topic search on this issue - many months ago we had discussed the key switches - both CH and CD’s offerings) and the ratings. It is really really best to set up the key switch for START and a heavy duty CH push button switch for GLOW (unless one has a preheat solenoid.)

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Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
So throw off the bowlines.  Sail away from the safe harbor.  Catch the tradewinds in your sails.
Explore.  Dream.  Discover.   -Mark Twain

Ron Hill

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2022, 02:45:57 PM »

Guys : The 1988 and subsequent MK1 engine panels should have a three way starter switch (OFF, ON , GLow plug - monetary) and a separate Starter switch.  The separate glow plug might be in the early 1988, but it was really last in the 1986 & 1987 production!!
I've seen an early 1988 with not only a separate glow plug switch, but it also had an ammeter! Just a left over engine panel from the year (1987) before!  Frank never throws anything away!!!

I changed my 3/4 length plexy to a full Lexon glass with drill holes for the key, starter, blower, and momentary press to test hi temp switches.  I installed rubber boots on all of them and have a Sunbrella UV cover for when docked!!  :thumb:

A few thoughts
« Last Edit: June 25, 2022, 12:57:40 PM by Ron Hill »
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Ron Hill

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Re: Keyed Ignition
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2022, 02:56:29 PM »

Guys : I had to change the key switch early - 1989? as the factory one broke!!  I got one at an auto store and used that 3 way for a few years before that one quit!! 

On most of the electrical switches I've learned that the marine environment eats up most automobile grade stuff, so I just spend the few extra $$ to get Cole Hersee or Anchor brands.  Saves alot of reinstallations and you have a much better reliability factor!!   :clap

A few thoughts
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