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Author Topic: Rudder misaligned from factory?  (Read 738 times)

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LogoFreak

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #15 on: April 13, 2020, 09:36:23 AM »

I did my own inspection, didn’t feel the need to spend $700 on a survey. I have more than enough experience with boat repair that I feel confident in my ability to asses a boat.
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1992 Catalina 34 mk1.5

LogoFreak

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #16 on: April 13, 2020, 12:19:59 PM »

I got a reply back from Catalina, the fact the top of the rudder tube appears off Center is only attributed to the tolerances when the deck and hull are joined together. I will confirm on next haul out that the actual rudder is aligned and not tilted to one side. I’m fairly confident it’s straight as I said during my inspection nothing stood out to me.
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1992 Catalina 34 mk1.5

Roc

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #17 on: April 13, 2020, 01:23:32 PM »

If Catalina says it's due to the "tolerances" when the deck and hull are joined together, then it seems to me there is something out between the hull and deck and to compensate and keep the rudder amidships, they had to drill the hole off center.  If that's the case, then you might be able to confirm what they are saying by seeing if the mating of the hull and deck are off, or something "out of place" that would require them to make this compensation.  These tolerances they refer to do seem extremely wide!!
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Roc - "Sea Life" 2000 MKII #1477.  Rock Hall, MD

Ron Hill

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #18 on: April 13, 2020, 03:12:52 PM »

Logo : You haven't mentioned the KEY point!! Will the emergency tiller fit into the slot on the rudder column or not???

If it does? then you don't have an emergency tiller problem!!  If it doesn't then....?? you can decide!?  I seriously doubt if the rudder is angled.

You still should address the corrosion on that Edson steering mechanism!!

A few thoughts
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Ron, Apache #788

scgunner

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #19 on: April 13, 2020, 05:32:56 PM »

"didn't feel the need to spend $700 on a survey" So how's that working out for you?
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Kevin Quistberg                                                 Top Gun 1987 Mk 1 Hull #273

Bob K

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #20 on: April 13, 2020, 06:02:17 PM »

I have Mk1.5 hull 1192, and have a very similar offset.  I noticed it years ago (2009) when I dropped the rudder to repair the seal between the post and rudder. 
At the time I verified the rudder was straight.  I did not try to figure out why the deck plate did not line up with it.    My quadrant also looked like yours due to a leak at the deck plate lock handle.   I replaced the entire access plate at the time.  Also cleaned and painted the quadrant. And blocked off the the inside of the rudder tube and epoxy sealed, so any future leaks would not allow water to go down the tube and into the rudder assembly.

This past year I noticed the deck plate leaking again, this time around the gasket, so I purchased what I thought was going to be a new o-ring seal from the deck plate mfr.  Instead they sent me a 24" length of gasket which I am supposed to fit and trim to size and butt the edges against each other.   and hope it doesn't leak.   Have not yet installed it.  Since I'm still not in the water, I'll take a look again next time I can get to the marina (who knows?) , and see if I can figure out the mystery offset.
So my advice for now is to not worry about the offset.  And fix the leak.
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Bob K
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1992 #1186
Northern Chesapeake Bay

Bob K

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #21 on: April 13, 2020, 06:03:46 PM »

forget to mention...... the emergency tiller DOES fit :clap :clap
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Bob K
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1992 #1186
Northern Chesapeake Bay

LogoFreak

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #22 on: April 13, 2020, 06:37:27 PM »

"didn't feel the need to spend $700 on a survey" So how's that working out for you?

Totally fine scguuner... you don't seem to understand the question I have asked. There is nothing wrong with the boat, I only was asking to see if others have found this on their boat as well. I have the same amount of knowledge as most surveyors if not more. If the insurance companies didn't require a survey I'd never bother getting one. Boat had a survey done 3 years ago and it passed with flying colours, yet there's a fair bit of blisters on the hull, no mention of that in the report... see what I'm getting at?

I resent your comment, you know what they say about people who ASSume right?
« Last Edit: April 13, 2020, 06:49:28 PM by LogoFreak »
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1992 Catalina 34 mk1.5

LogoFreak

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #23 on: April 13, 2020, 06:39:55 PM »

Logo : You haven't mentioned the KEY point!! Will the emergency tiller fit into the slot on the rudder column or not???

If it does? then you don't have an emergency tiller problem!!  If it doesn't then....?? you can decide!?  I seriously doubt if the rudder is angled.

You still should address the corrosion on that Edson steering mechanism!!

A few thoughts

Emergency tiller fits just fine, there is no issue with the boat. Only reason I asked about the visual misalignment is because I'm installing a below deck autopilot this season and will have to fabricate a bulkhead to bolt on the linear drive. If the factory made a mistake I can easily correct it now, would be harder to do later as I would have to redo what I did while installing the linear drive. I will remove the radial drive wheel and inspect it closer, order a new one if it's necessary as I have to order the AP tiller arm from Edson anyway.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2020, 06:56:12 PM by LogoFreak »
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1992 Catalina 34 mk1.5

LogoFreak

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #24 on: April 13, 2020, 06:42:26 PM »

I have Mk1.5 hull 1192, and have a very similar offset.  I noticed it years ago (2009) when I dropped the rudder to repair the seal between the post and rudder. 
At the time I verified the rudder was straight.  I did not try to figure out why the deck plate did not line up with it.    My quadrant also looked like yours due to a leak at the deck plate lock handle.   I replaced the entire access plate at the time.  Also cleaned and painted the quadrant. And blocked off the the inside of the rudder tube and epoxy sealed, so any future leaks would not allow water to go down the tube and into the rudder assembly.

This past year I noticed the deck plate leaking again, this time around the gasket, so I purchased what I thought was going to be a new o-ring seal from the deck plate mfr.  Instead they sent me a 24" length of gasket which I am supposed to fit and trim to size and butt the edges against each other.   and hope it doesn't leak.   Have not yet installed it.  Since I'm still not in the water, I'll take a look again next time I can get to the marina (who knows?) , and see if I can figure out the mystery offset.
So my advice for now is to not worry about the offset.  And fix the leak.

Awesome! that is what I wanted to know! Much appreciate you replying to my question with the picture.
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1992 Catalina 34 mk1.5

LogoFreak

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #25 on: April 13, 2020, 06:47:06 PM »

I will be doing a lot of repairs and a somewhat extensive refit over the next little while, the leak is low on my priority list at the moment. I've only owned this particular boat for just over a week so still exploring and compiling a list of "to do's" and "Must do's"

This boat as a lot of other Catalinas has a sloppy rudder, next spring when I haul out to do a blister treatment I will be replacing the rudder tube. I will be going with the Jefa rudder bearing system, 0 slop and very little resistance if any. Here's the link if any are interested https://www.jefa.com/rudder.htm
« Last Edit: April 13, 2020, 07:07:46 PM by LogoFreak »
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1992 Catalina 34 mk1.5

lazybone

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #26 on: April 14, 2020, 02:12:06 AM »

If Catalina says it's due to the "tolerances" when the deck and hull are joined together, then it seems to me there is something out between the hull and deck and to compensate and keep the rudder amidships, they had to drill the hole off center.  If that's the case, then you might be able to confirm what they are saying by seeing if the mating of the hull and deck are off, or something "out of place" that would require them to make this compensation.  These tolerances they refer to do seem extremely wide!!

Allowable“Tolerances” in aircraft are .00  I think what the Catalina guy meant was  Allowaable “tolerances in their boats are measured in fractions of feet.
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Ciao tutti


S/V LAZYBONES  #677

Roc

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #27 on: April 14, 2020, 08:39:00 AM »

Looks like Bob K has the same off-set of the tube.  My guess is the molds were not made correctly and to get the rudder in the correct place, Catalina had to drill the hole off-center to the place where they "thought" the center would be when the deck and hull were joined.  Probably other Mk I boats of the same year(s) are similar to this.  I would think your autopilot install should be OK, since the rudder is probably properly centered amidships and the fact that it's off-center in the deck indentation doesn't matter.
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Roc - "Sea Life" 2000 MKII #1477.  Rock Hall, MD

Ron Hill

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #28 on: April 14, 2020, 05:03:00 PM »

Guys : As I said the hull is in a jig.  I'll guess that the hole in the top half of the deck is pre drilled before the top deck and hull are mated.

Also it would look funny with that emergency tiller cap hole if it was not centered in the cockpit floor!!  Just a poor design of the top half!!

Remember that Catalina was throwing about 1200 -1500 C34 hulls alone (not counting C22s, c30s, and C36s) out of the Woodlawn factory!!

A few thoughts
« Last Edit: April 15, 2020, 01:45:14 PM by Ron Hill »
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Noah

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Re: Rudder misaligned from factory?
« Reply #29 on: April 14, 2020, 05:31:45 PM »

I wonder what year that “misalignment” was addressed, altered or if it was left to continue in perpetuity.  It might be a fun exercise to ask all MK1.5 - MkII members to take/post a photo down their emergency tiller deck plate hole to see if any of them are centered! 8)
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