Join the C34 Association Today!
[C34 Home] [C34Tech Notes] [C34 Tech Wiki] [Join!]
Please login or register.
Advanced search  

News:

Pages: [1] 2   Go Down

Author Topic: New sails Experiences/Recommendations  (Read 482 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Patches

  • Forum - Seaman
  • **
  • Karma: 3
  • Posts: 38
    • View Profile
New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« on: November 13, 2019, 04:31:54 PM »

Time for new sails, and my head is spinning a little after wading into this topic online.  I just replaced my furler with a new Harken, and after a consultation with my rigger determined it is also time for new sails.  The primary need is a new furling genoa, to be followed by a new main. 

I favor going to my local loft(s) for sails, even though I have purchased a Rolly Tasker (National) main for a prior boat which I found very well made. My C34 came with a spare UK roller furling genoa in a bag which I suspect was purchased from Catalina or Catalina Direct. Although in decent shape, the UV ''dacron" cover is toast and the leech tabling is well worn with the leech cord visible in several spots.  It looks a lot like the Ullmans sold on CD.  Because of my decision to raise the new furler up off the deck using long link plates, it really isn't economical to both (1) re-cut it, and (2) replace the UV cover.  I'll definitely go with a better made genoa, with a real Sunbrella UV cover.

The two local lofts I prefer gave me quotes for an "offshore" quality furling genoa:  crosscut, using Marblehead dacron, Sunbrella UV cover with Tenara thread, foam luff, and reinforcements in the right places (double taped edges, leather reinforced clew, etc..)  I'm also getting quotes for a tri-radial genoa using Warp drive cloth.
 
To my surprise, each loft outsources to Durtek (Quantum) in Sri Lanka, and each likes the work that Durtek does in manufacturing sails.  This would seem to provide the benefits of offshore pricing with the measurement/follow-up/repair/quality assurance of a local loft.  My questions for the learned panel:

1. Anyone had direct experience with a sail built by Durtek?

2. If so, were you pleased with the quality?  Was it the "offshore"-level sail or other?

3. Anyone ordered sails from National/Rolly Tasker recently?  What was your experience?  Its been about 8 years since I ordered my last sail from them.

4. Anyone gone with Precision out of BC?  My understanding is that they build in China, and QC in Victoria BC.  Several of the popular sailing vlogs have used them and seem happy with the (sponsored) sails.  Your experience?

As always, thanks in advance for your responses.

Patches
Logged

Noah

  • Administrator
  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer
  • *******
  • Karma: 19
  • Posts: 1570
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2019, 05:25:45 PM »

No experience with Tasker, Quantum, Uk, but all “strong” names.  I have Ullman sails now and on a previous sailboat had North Sails  I would recommend that you use a local “rep.” or loft (whatever franchise supplier) who will standby your purchase/measurement/fit/satisfaction—regardless of where the sails are actually manufactured.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2019, 06:45:18 PM by Noah »
Logged
1990 hull #1014, San Diego, CA,  Fin Keel,
Standard Rig

Craig Illman

  • Forum - Chief Petty Officer
  • ******
  • Karma: 12
  • Posts: 962
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #2 on: November 14, 2019, 06:34:43 AM »

My Precision sails for my C30 were labeled as produced in Sri Lanka. I was happy with the product and process.

Craig
Logged

Jeff Kaplan

  • Forum - Petty Officer 1st Class
  • *****
  • Karma: 2
  • Posts: 413
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2019, 08:21:39 AM »

I recently lost my North Genoa, 135, in a severe wind storm, unfortunately boat was at the mooring, sailed furled, and the wind somehow caught a weak point right above the genny lines, and ripped the sail to shreds. I got an insurance claim check and ordered a new 135 Genoa from Doyle Sails. Good price, great quality, excellent company to deal with. This division is located in the next town to me,Salem,Ma. but they have many locations outside Ma.
Logged
#219, 1986 tall rig/shallow draft. "sedona sunset" atlantic-salem,ma

Ted Pounds

  • Forum - Chief Petty Officer
  • ******
  • Karma: 8
  • Posts: 822
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2019, 11:26:14 AM »

I recently lost my North Genoa, 135, in a severe wind storm, unfortunately boat was at the mooring, sailed furled, and the wind somehow caught a weak point right above the genny lines, and ripped the sail to shreds. I got an insurance claim check and ordered a new 135 Genoa from Doyle Sails. Good price, great quality, excellent company to deal with. This division is located in the next town to me,Salem,Ma. but they have many locations outside Ma.

I always roll mine up so the sheets are wrapped around the furled sail about 3 or 4 times. It may not look as neat, but it prevents that from happening.
Logged
Ted Pounds
"Molly Rose"
1987 #447

Jeff Kaplan

  • Forum - Petty Officer 1st Class
  • *****
  • Karma: 2
  • Posts: 413
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #5 on: November 15, 2019, 03:42:58 PM »

Ted, the Genoa was wrapped that way, wind just got under some area just above or below the genny lines and started the shredding. There were almost hurricane force winds, sustained over 2 days. Nobody expected it to be that strong or I would have gone to the boat and removed the sails. Oh well, I'm getting a new sail for next season. Boats on the hard, winterized and covered. See her in the spring.
Logged
#219, 1986 tall rig/shallow draft. "sedona sunset" atlantic-salem,ma

Ted Pounds

  • Forum - Chief Petty Officer
  • ******
  • Karma: 8
  • Posts: 822
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #6 on: November 16, 2019, 01:05:44 PM »

Wow! 😵   I guess you were lucky that the genny was the only thing damaged.  At least you now know you have a secure mooring.  :thumb:
Logged
Ted Pounds
"Molly Rose"
1987 #447

Jeff Kaplan

  • Forum - Petty Officer 1st Class
  • *****
  • Karma: 2
  • Posts: 413
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #7 on: November 16, 2019, 04:15:56 PM »

Amen to that, we found a light bulb on deck, cotter pins, possibly blown over from another boat. In the spring, I'm going to have my rigger check out everything, the boat was rocking and rollin', I never realized how many nuts, bolts,washers and screws I had on board, my tool box ended up on the sole and everything was scattered about. What a mess.
Logged
#219, 1986 tall rig/shallow draft. "sedona sunset" atlantic-salem,ma

Roland Gendreau

  • Forum - Petty Officer 1st Class
  • *****
  • Karma: 3
  • Posts: 276
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #8 on: November 16, 2019, 07:27:12 PM »

I was very satisfied by the Rolly Tasker main and genoa that I bought for my C30.  The new owners of my C30 sailed them for quite a while after they bought the boat.   I considered RollyTasker for my C34 but was able to get better value from Somerset sails, who offered me a trade in credit on my Main and installed Dutchman hardware for free.

Logged
Roland Gendreau
1992 MK 1.5
Gratitude #1183
Bristol, RI

dw

  • Forum - Seaman Apprentice
  • *
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 9
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #9 on: November 20, 2019, 06:45:05 PM »

Hello Roland, yes I hear you on choosing sails between options, sail material and budget.  If you are looking mail order have you looked at Mack sails?  I have not used them but am impressed with their web site I thought there was some good information there.  I did get a quote very competitive.  Am interested to hear anyone else experience with Mack.  Many cruiser in this area use Bacon's Sails in Annapolis they are OK.  I purchased a main for my last boat there was nice no complaints.

DW
Logged

Patches

  • Forum - Seaman
  • **
  • Karma: 3
  • Posts: 38
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #10 on: November 21, 2019, 07:39:14 AM »

Thanks, as always, for everyone's feedback.  After much research and input, here is my experience and ultimate decision.

The quotes received from sailmakers/dealers often made it difficult to compare "apples to apples."  Except for Mack Sails, the quotes received were for sails  made offshore but with some form of quality control by the various sailmakers.  I found the differences to be as follows:

1.  Rolly Tasker/National: Very helpful, calls answered or returned same day.  Construction in Thailand, QC in Florida.  Customer provides sail measurements.  Sail options determined by boat size.  For Catalina 34 owners, this means the sails fall within the "Coastal Cruising." The construction appears to be a good value (crosscut construction, sunbrella UV cover, 8 ounce "high modulus" dacron fabric)  at the base price of $1640.  If you want a foam luff, however, there is a $165 upcharge.  Shipping was quoted at "about $100." My inquiry about using Tenara UV thread on the UV cover was dismissed as being 'too expensive."

2.  Precision Sails: Very helpful, calls answered or returned same day.  Construction in China, QC in Victoria, BC. Customer provides sail measurements. Great website with lots of information about sailcloth, and lots of Youtube videos showing sails sail features prior to being shipped to customers. Detailed quotes based on graduated level of quality sought (300 level, 400 level, or 500 level (offshore).  Options also available for "crosscut", "tri-radial," and "racing".  Precision starts with low quotes for the basic sail category, but then upcharges for things like Sunbrella UV cover (+$137), foam luff (+$120), double tape edges (+$109 with Offshore package), and clew reinforcement (+$169 for Elite package).  No taxes, shipping quoted as "about $100."

3.  Mack Sails:  Helpful website, prompt response to request for quote.  Construction in Florida.  Customer provides sail measurements.  Different approach to sailmaking, in that believes in same upper level of quality for all sails/sailcloth.  Constructs headsails using a "mitre cut" construction (vs. crosscut), Marblemount sail cloth, Sunbrella UV cover with Tenara thread, foam luff, all double taped edges and leather reinforced clews, and special detail on leech/foot lines to avoid wear though of lines.  Impressive.  Offseason quote for 125% furling genoa at just under $2500, and no upcharges.

4.  Local lofts:  Very responsive. Will measure for sail and bend on when received.  Construction at the Quantum loft in Sri Lanka, QC at the local lofts.  Will construct in "Crosscut", "tri-radial", and "racing." Base level offered in "offshore" construction with Marblemount sailcloth, Sunbrella UV cover sewed on with Tenara thread, foam luff, double taped edges, and leather reinforced clew.  Quote for Crosscut at $2000, and $2285 for "Tri-radial" using Newport Pro-Radial dacron sailcloth. No shipping, but local sales taxes of 9%.

Based on the quotes, and my personal needs, I elected to go with my local sailmaker in a "tri-radial" offshore furling genoa.  I paid an upcharge ($50) for a non-standard Sunbrella cover of Silver.  Tri-radial, I learned, is a different construction than the "mitre-cut" offered by Mack Sails. It is generally understood to be a superior construction for sail shape because it orients the loads on the sail in the same direction as the sail cloth leading to less stretch over time.  That should translate into longer life for the sail.  Cross-cut construction, which is the easiest and cheapest way to construct a sail, is usually more than adequate for most boat owners--especially when it is made of high quality fabric like Marbelmount.  As a charter captain I can be out three times a day in the high season, and my sails get more use than those of a typical boat.   I went with a tri-radial furling genoa for both the superior shape and lower stretch. Hopefully it will also prove to be longer lived.

I hope my experience can be used by others wading into this process.

Patches

Logged

KWKloeber

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
  • ********
  • Karma: 32
  • Posts: 3428
  • "Positive Impact" 1984 C-30 #3573 trbsfk M-25
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2019, 06:02:30 PM »


I always roll mine up so the sheets are wrapped around the furled sail about 3 or 4 times. It may not look as neat, but it prevents that from happening.


Another thing I do for "storage" is to use one of the old (3/8? 5/16"?) reefing lines that PO had on my original main.  It's maybe 24" long?  Just enough for two wraps around the furled sail, one wrap above, one below the sheets - which I can reach on the 30 standing on the pulpit, and a square knot.  She's safe and sound.
Logged
Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
So throw off the bowlines.  Sail away from the safe harbor.  Catch the tradewinds in your sails.
Explore.  Dream.  Discover.   -Mark Twain

Ron Hill

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
  • ********
  • Karma: 52
  • Posts: 6781
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #12 on: November 23, 2019, 01:38:38 PM »

Guys : After you wrap the sheets around the rolled genoa 3/4 times, also make sure that you tighten the sheet lines and furling line so there isn't any slack in either!!  You can also tie a separate line around the furled wrap!

A thought
« Last Edit: December 04, 2019, 02:29:59 PM by Ron Hill »
Logged
Ron, Apache #788

Graham

  • Forum - Seaman Apprentice
  • *
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 5
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #13 on: December 01, 2019, 12:17:05 PM »

I used Crusader Sails based (and made) in Poole, UK.  This is my third set of sails on my C34 and they are by far the best and are very reasonably priced.

Graham
C34 mk2 #1376 'Smooth Jazz' built 1997.
Chichester, West Sussex, UK
Logged
Graham
C34 Mk II #1376 Smooth Jazz
Chichester, West Sussex, UK

Bill Shreeves

  • Forum - Petty Officer 2nd Class
  • ****
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 191
    • View Profile
Re: New sails Experiences/Recommendations
« Reply #14 on: December 01, 2019, 01:06:34 PM »

I recently lost my North Genoa, 135, in a severe wind storm, unfortunately boat was at the mooring, sailed furled, and the wind somehow caught a weak point right above the genny lines, and ripped the sail to shreds. I got an insurance claim check and ordered a new 135 Genoa from Doyle Sails. Good price, great quality, excellent company to deal with. This division is located in the next town to me,Salem,Ma. but they have many locations outside Ma.

My Harken furler has a couple of holes in the bottom spool that I clip a $4 wire lock pin through to keep this from happening and it works like a champ.  When sailing I clip it to the bow pulpit.  https://www.amazon.com/Buyers-66070-Wire-Lock-Square/dp/B0087PALFY/ref=zg_bs_15737361_10?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=T4WFB48R1YMQGFFH643E
Logged
The only thing that always works on an old boat is the owner...

Bill Shreeves
s/v "Begnnings" 1987 Shoal Draft #333
M25XPB, Worton Creek, MD
Pages: [1] 2   Go Up