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Topics - KWKloeber

#1
Main Message Board / 35% off Lewmar hatches
January 21, 2024, 09:39:09 AM
#2
Main Message Board / Trusted surveyor in Chi Town?
December 13, 2023, 11:42:53 AM
Does anyone know of a trusted buyer's surveyor in the Chicago area?
#3
These are new, sold to a customer; Universal copper-bronze; they were installed on a "mechanic-rebuilt" XP that threw a rod upon start up.  The owner salvaged these and now has a Beta so no longer needs them. 

Seller asking $560 for both - negotiate on your own.

See photos of them here:
https://groups.io/g/Catalina30/message/112829

Location: CT, USA.
Contact Victor Arcelus (-do not reply here.)
varcelus
at
gmail.com


Thx
Ken
#4
A fellow Universal owner that a "mechanic" worked on has issues w/ it loading up and stalling:

Has anyone run across a similar issue on an older (non-B series) Universal?

The "mechanic":

R&R'd the Gear Cover to replace gaskets and the crank oil seal.
R& had a diesel shop rebuild the Injection Pump and Injectors.

The result:

Engine back together, IP and injectors serviced by an external company.
Started up and runs smoother, no leak (yet) from the crank seal.
Everything seemed good until I rev'd up and put it in gear.

Put it in forward and the Universal sounds like a huge load put on it. It stutters and dies.
Try again in reverse, same thing.

Checked the prop -- spins freely, no weeds.
Checked the transmission fluid, ok.
#6
Hey
I occasionally see owners asking about local canvas people.
I am passing along that a C-30 member, Ward Hutton, started doing custom new mains'l covers and repairs

The info is here if anyone is interested...

https://groups.io/g/Catalina30/message/112537
https://groups.io/g/Catalina30/wiki/34416

Contact Ward Hutton
Sundogsailingc30@gmail.com

Cheers,
Ken

PS: I don't have any association w/ this except that Ward is one of our good association members!
#8
Max's family had informed the Association of his sudden passing.  The following will appear in the Spring Mainsheet issue:

A sad day for the Catalina 30 Family.
Millard "Max" Munger, Jr., 78, passed unexpectedly on January 4.  The Association fondly remembers Max as having many loves but primarily his deep passion for the C30 and his unselfish and unwavering dedication to its membership.  He served as Commodore multiple times, initiated and administered the website and email forums, handled membership and financial aspects, and was the Association's steadfast guiding beacon.  His heart was as huge as his stature and he was easily recognized by sight and his hearty laugh.  He will be missed but joyfully remembered forever as "Mr. Catalina 30."  Our collective hearts and prayers are extended to Max's family.



Due to the timing of his passing and publication deadline, the Association officers will be preparing a more extensive celebration of Max's life to publish in the Mainsheet Summer issue.
#9
Has anyone with an M25 or XP experienced an oil lesk that gets slunged all over and coats the cover, coolant hose, and whatnot else?

(this is another owner's issue)
He hasn't yet been able to narrow down the source.

This is < 5 min running after completely cleaning the cover bone dry:

#10
Main Message Board / Defender Marine sold
February 19, 2022, 08:19:09 AM
https://groups.io/g/Catalina30/message/109823

Hmmm :think ... needed a quick capital infusion or just cashing out :donno: ??
#11
I am in the process of rewiring a brand new panel because the CD panels have cheap, non-marine, non-heat shrink, StaKon auto terminals.  Here's a few things I discovered that you might want to check if you have installed a CD panel:

1) Three of the wires pulled out of the terminals (see pic.) Yikes.  :shock:
They are cheap terminals and poorly crimped.

2) None of the terminals were properly crimped with the correct tool as none had the wire strain relief crimped.

3) Two or three of the nuts on the gauge terminals were finger tight.

4) The feed from the key switch to the preheat [edit] START PB switch was 14 ga, not 10 ga as it should be.

5) Every ring terminal was the wrong size - generally a #10 ring on a #8 terminal post.

There's just no reason for this on a brandy new wired panel.  What trashy work.  :?

#12
Main Message Board / BROKEN WIKI
April 24, 2021, 08:09:34 AM
The link to the wiki page that is in the message below is broken.
https://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,10982.msg86941.html#msg86941

If the link is copy/pasted directly into a browser if works (but clicking on the link in the message bring up the wiki error in pic below.)

In plain speak, the link in msg 86941 is correct but something is broken because it ain't working.


#13
Some additional (incorrect, non factual) arguments why the OEM preheat circuit is "bad." 
[With the incorrect "facts" corrected]:

"..the current must travel in a #16 gage wire.."
The preheat circuit is 10 awg and has always been 10 awg.

"...the voltage at #3 cylinder... must be only a dribble.  "
The voltage drop is 1.2 v over 32 feet (16' up/16' back) with (3) 6 amp glowplugs.
Newer plugs *reportedly* draw about 9a each. That's 1.6v drop over 32 feet.
Not a "dribble" at all, it gets the voltage closer to (a little bit above ) what the GPs are designed for.


"Why NOT [do the MOD] !?!"
Here's ONE reason:

February 13, 2017
Subject: NGK Y-103V glow plug question
To: [me]
Hello,
Thank you for your inquiry. It will definitely damage the glow plug by putting direct battery voltage to it. There is a resistor in the controller box so the glow plug only receives 10.5V. [NGK's referring to the Kubota tractor preheat circuit - k]
NGK


"...never measured the voltage at #3 cylinder..."
I have, and the drop was consistent with above.

"... that dribble must ... energize the next 2 plugs"
There's about 0.02v drop in 6" of wire, so plug to plug the voltage is identical by any measurable means that we have.  There's no drop GP to GP due to the GPs themselves (such as if they were wired in series.)
However, that's a good point -- it makes sense to feed to the #2 cyl, then split to #1 / #3 GP.


"...the Ford truck solenoid mod. will allow you to just open a circuit (for 2/3 seconds)"
First, there's NO WAY on this Earth that a proper, maintained, preheat circuit takes 30 seconds that the mod can reduce to 2-3 seconds.  If so, then something was drastically wrong with the OEM preheat wiring before the mod and so not a fair comparison.  The mod shortens preheat by between 10-15 seconds, depending on temperature.  To be fair, lets just say it cuts the time in half.

"...Why energize that circuit for 30 some seconds (dragging down the battery/s starting power)..."
It takes "X" amount of energy to heat the glow plug -- more seconds @ lower volts and amps OR fewer seconds @ higher volts and amps.  The difference between the mod/no mod is 0.05 amp-hr. Insignificant. 
Likewise, the total energy to preheat is insignificant (between about 0.1 and 0.2 amp-hr.)
Additionally, introducing a Ford solenoid (meant to handle STARTING amps) draws another 1-2 amps from the battery that isn't required if you leave the OEM circuit as-is.


"...the old original charging circuit thru the gummy plugs was bad ... why would you do the same with the glow plugs?"
Because that's arguing Koolaid and Gatoraid.  Apples/oranges.  Different animals.  A strawman argument.
No one is suggesting that the preheat go thru a plug.  A classic strawman argument!

Second, we know the differences between charge and preheat -- anyone well versed about harness issues knows that they had nothing to do with the preheat circuit.  Nevetheless, info for uninformed owners:
The key to the harness was the PLUG itself and the resulting fire hazard from:
     * CONTINUOUS high charge current from the alt. (not much lower, intermittent, preheating.)
     * Corrosion at the plug heating/expanding/burning contacts and adding more corrosion/resistance, and finally melting the plug -- and the resulting fire hazard.
     * The drop in voltage and inefficient charging.

Leaving the GP circuit as OEM has nothing to do with those issues.  Read again above from NGK, why you WANT a voltage drop in the original GP circuit and NOT put 12-1/2 or possibly 14-1/2 volts (from a shore charger) to them. 
That's the absolute opposite of the concern/problem with the charge circuit running up to the cockpit.





Quote

When we tried to start the engine, nothing happened.  I knew exactly what it was, because ten years earlier I had replaced the start button to starter solenoid fuse holder, and had since relocated it to a more accessible spot (see Critical Upgrades).  I hopped down below, opened the engine compartment and messed with the fuse holder, and asked Morgan to try to start the engine.  It turned over this time, but didn't start because it was cold.  By then those large racing sailboats were bearing down on us, having slid out of the dead zone and hit the breeze.  We could see the bones in their teeth, a few heading right for us.

I told Morgan to hit the glow plug button for 12-15 seconds, and then the engine started right up.  And we motored out of their way, close call.

Do I mind being able to start my engine faster?  No.
Do I need it all the time?  No.
Do I appreciate having it.  You betcha.



Of course, the question is not whether one has the right to YBYC or not. Of course everyone does.
The question is -- if critically thinking about it -- does it make sense?  To some it always will, no matter the facts.  To some the facts outweigh the potential 10-second time saving.  C'mon men n ladies - TEN SECONDS.  Really think about that.  Ten WHOLE seconds.   Now let it sink in. 

It's not (just) dem glo plugs. Yes, shortening the preheat time does (somewhat but not in every instance) counteract the higher voltage.  But, there's also the case where you're putting not just 12v to a 10v plug, but putting 14.5v to 10v plugs.

If that's acceptable to some -- great so be it if one wants to do it -- YBYC -- but it doesn't automatically transform it into being a smart idea when critically thinking and weighing the facts, not the emotion over it (a hot glo plug button issue, so to speak.)  Some get defensive because they have done something or installed something, that maybe wasn't deadly, but maybe also was not the best move.  I've done "not the best move" many times, but learn from it instead of defending it.  Some were doozies, but again it doesn't automatically transform them onto a good move just because I had decided to do it.

If the life/death situation comes down to me being north or south of 15 seconds, d'yah think there's potentially something else wrong?  Like me not being prepared, or me simply being reckless about the location I was approaching?  (What I forgot, this breakwall just popped up on me?)  Or like me forgetting to start the engine well ahead of time if there's a potential that I may need it, rather than me waiting until life/death depends on 10 seconds vs 20 seconds of preheat.

We ought not lose sight of the FACT that, given a choice, we ought to make systems LESS complicated on a boat, not MORE complicated when it's absolutely, positively unnecessary (an only a "niceity") to do so.  That's not just an opinion that's a GOOD idea on a boat.  Relays and solenoids do fail -- infinitely more often if I install unnecessary ones compared to when I don't install unnecessary ones.  Connections do corrode - infinitely more often when I install unnecessary ones than when I don't install unnecessary ones.

Murphy stows away each and every time each one of us goes out.
What's more simple than a fuseholder?  If that fails and puts me in a life/death situation that relies on 10 seconds to get out of, what about a different, more complicated (and totally unnecessary) component failing?  That can never happen to me?  Until it happens, of course.  Murphy.  We all know him.  :shock:

A failure like that speaks more to the installation or the part I used, than having a fallback 10-second savior to a fuse holder failing.  That's akin to me justifying to myself to carry 10 gals of explosion in my trunk just for the happenstance that I will be thankful when I didn't start with tankfull that I had the gas can to fall back on.  Or if my fuel gauge goes haywire.  Or I "forgot" that I was going to drive thru the desert and "forgot" to fill up.  Yes, at some obsure point in my life I might be glad that I carried that tank, and I could use that to justify it to myself if someone said to me, "Yah know, that's not a great idea, but it's your car, your choice."

I've seen three preheat solenoids fail on the B engines, and they weren't abused.

If using a relay, it has small quick-disconnect terminals that can corrode, not even screw terminals (QD terminals don't belong anywhere on a boat - maybe on a sound system/speakers is ok.)
When an unnecesary added preheat component fails you're not just screwed, you're really screwed. :cry4`

1) Will a preheat relay work?  Yes.
2) Wil it work absolutely, positively, 100% of the time?  No!!
3) Is it necessary to have?  No!!
4) Will our engines start very well without it?  Yes, they were designed to!
5) So will it be detrimental to install it, to the point my engine won't start?   Only if the unnecessary relay or solenoid fails (see #2.)
5) Did Kubota have any concern about over-voltage on glow plugs?  Yes, it installed a power resistor to reduce the voltage from 12v.
6) So why then do folks install it?  Beats me, being ignorant of the facts maybe?  Koolaid maybe?  The sheep factor maybe "My dockmate did it"?

If ONE MUST -- install a mounted soecket type with a quick plug-in relay, and keep a spare relay where you know where it is and can grab it within 20-25 seconds.  Or better yet, in 10-15 seconds.  :shock:
#14
Main Message Board / Forum email notification snafu
September 11, 2020, 09:01:03 PM
Has ANYONE experienced (or figured out the fix for) not being consistently notified of new replies to message posts?

I get (usually?!?!) an email for the first message in a topic, but after that notifications are inconsistent. 

Sometimes I get one or two notifications of follow-up messages, but usually no further notifications.  I'm at a loss what profile setting may or may not be be blocking these notifications???  It started and had continued for about the last year.

(** Emails are NOT going to spam or some other place -- I 've checked all my mailboxes.)

Thx
-k
#15
A cross-post from a C-30 owner w/ a problem.  I hope if someone has experienced this and determined the cause at this specific location they will chime in.

Quote

We purchased this 3 inch heat exchanger about four years ago and it's worked wonders on our engine heating issues. We periodically check and replace zincs in the heat exchanger. But there's a growing amount of corrosion around the nipple for the zinc threads. I'm wondering if others have seen this happen, and believing I need to change that soon or else I'm gonna have a leak?
[/color]




#17
Main Message Board / Forum and C34 links screwed up?
September 26, 2019, 02:22:01 PM
David S -

(maybe others have experienced this?)

1) I now get redirected to the non-secure site - http - when clicking on the forum link on the secure (https) main page. 
Ditto for the Tech Notes link on the main page.
I think you had corrected this once before?
  I hadn't tried every link on the main page, so there might be others that direct to http.

2) Also a few months ago I started NOT getting email notices of every forum posting (the emails seem to come haphazardly) - I have played with the settings but cannot get that function back. I have NO TOPICS clicked as "unfollow"

Any thought how to get this back?

3) The icons for the smileys have disappeared.

Thx
Ken
#18
Are the top and bottom scenarios equivalent? 
i.e., Will the SG100 work correctly in both setups?

#19
SOLD


If anyone is interested in a Balmar Smart Gauge to monitor your bank, PM me (or preferably via the email link
<to the left).

This is the SG100, the simple gauge to install, not the SG200 that does have more bells and whistles and works off installing a shunt (more difficult to install.)

New, in box, never installed -- Make offer!

Ken
#20
Main Message Board / Latest Boating Safety Topic
May 18, 2019, 09:54:07 PM
Safety Newsletters (most recent first)






#21
All:

I have an acquaintance who is Vessel Safety Examiner and publishes a periodic safety newsletter.  I find Bob's articles are to-the-point and useful, not fluff.

-ken
#22
Just passing this along. Unsure if these can be adapted to y'alls, or maybe you know someone who can use them.... From 355 group:

4/24/19
Dear Group,
Has anyone bought or sold an asymmetrical sail and bow sprit recently?
I may have one, sparingly used for sale and I am trying to determine pricing.

Regards

https://groups.google.com/forum/m/?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer#!msg/catalina355/ffuKMp-_02s/1_vtcXB2CQAJ
#23
How about this for brightwork?



https://youtu.be/8TRjMidb-Qs

A mere $30k.


#24
Main Message Board / Marine batteries 25% off
February 17, 2019, 03:05:49 PM
Advance auto has a limited time 25% online code that's good for marine starting, etc., batteries

discount code CTP3BX
#25
[edit] shorter permalink

See here if you want info on helping out Coasties in need during this Washington idiocy:  :twisted:

https://groups.io/g/catalina30/topic/29188727

-ken
#26
XPB owners, here's what your engine looks like (basically) not including the added marineized parts (and deducting the non-marine ones, like the mechanical fuel pump.) 

Note the different valve cover.  Your intake manifold has a knockout plug to accept a Kb part (hose stub-out, shown) to which you can attach your crankcase breather hose rather than dangling it next to the air breather (as Wb did.)




#29
Main Message Board / mauri pro end of season sale
September 18, 2018, 08:59:51 AM
A heads up.
Some of the discounts on hardware that i saw looked pretty good.

Subject: Mauri Pro End of Season Savings
From: Mauri Pro Sailing <newsletter@mauriprosailing.com

See for details:
https://groups.io/g/catalina30/message/100818

-ken
#30
Hey all y'all.... passing along a request from my bro.
Anyone that has charts, chart book, info on the GBIP that they would be willing to share, loan, sell, rent (2019 trip planned) please ping me off list?

Thx!!
#31
I have:

Oil pan and dipstick tube -- Unused.

The pan fits all M-25 and XP/XPA/XPA(C) , but is like the pan on the EARLY M-25s -- it does not have the boss for the oil drain hose banjo. 
It never bothers me because I use a sucker and get 99.9% of the oil out, more than ones with the drain hose mounted mid-pan.
A welder could add the boss. 
Alternately, with your pans accessible, I would add a drain plug on the bottom rear of the pan.  Anyway, YBYC

The Universal cost is $800 for the pair, sell $500 for both.  NEW, never used -- the oil pan ITSELF from Westerbeke is $567.
The dipstick tube is no longer available from any dealer I am told so I'd like to sell together, but if anyone really needs one or the other, I'd consider breaking them up.  I'll throw in new gaskets if you take both.

Gear Cover - perfectly good, used like-new condition

Gear cover (mistakenly called timing cover) for the M-25 and XP/XPA/XPA(C).
These sold for $1,262 but are are no longer available.  Sell $500.

Ken

<<-- PM me or preferably email via the link to left or
Ken <at> WeekendRProducts <dot> com
#32
Am I correct, on panels that have the circuit board that trips the hi-temp alarm, the circuit board can be checked by shorting the temp sender lead to ground?

The hi-temp alarm obviously doesn't sound at key-on (it's low temp), but shorting the sender should simulate a hi-temp condition (> 200 F, low resistance in the sender) and sound the overheat alarm?

Seems correct anyway?  Can anyone verify that?

cheers
-k
#33
Main Message Board / Engine manuals uploaded
July 16, 2017, 06:28:17 PM
Additional engine manuals (searchable PDFs) for the B series are uploaded to the TechWiki "Manuals" topic.

kk
#34
If anyone is installing Westerbeke cast/threaded parts (like an exhaust flange) be cautious and carefully check the casting (hopefully before you pay for it.)  See below:

kk

Xxxxx,

I attached 10 photos of the problems with Westerbeke castings.  This is the THIRD casing I bought that has come thru and is crap.

The FLANGE is unusable - the hole and threads are not concentric, so only 1/2 of it has thread.
    flange with thread.jpg - the enlarged areas shows a deep cut thread.
    flange no thread.jpg - the enlarged areas show the opposite side with virtually no thread.
    flange top.jpg - the shop couldn't describe exactly why to me, so they shaved a few thousandths off the hub to expose the cause.  See the different thicknesses -- the thread was not cut concentric to the hole.

RISER #1 - had the 1-1/4" inlet thread cut uneven and it was cut twice with 2 sets of threads that overlapped at one point on the circumference.  The two threads were offset by about half a thread pitch, or approx 0.04".)
    riser 1 inlet a.jpg - see two different sets of threads (left and right), and area (between blue arrows) where the threading overlapped  Red arrows show that thread on the right, was cut deeper than thread on the left.
    riser 1 inlet b.jpg - I ran in a tap (by hand) to see what happened.  The enlarged areas show where it cut new thread (shiny) into the left thread, but didn't cut into the right side thread (still painted.)  What it was doing was cutting away the thread that was offset by 1/23 inch (1/2 the thread pitch.)

RISER #2 top plug - the threading was similar to the flange, thread and hole were not concentric.
    riser 2 top plug.jpg - 3/4 of the hole had thread, 1/4 had no thread.
   
RISER side threads - are really bad on ALL RISERS that I have seen.  The thread IS NOT 3/4" NPT. 
It is straight, not tapered NPT thread.  I don't know if it's NPS, or British  or JIS straight, but it's not NPT.
    riser 2 barb a.jpg - 3/4" barb marked at hand tightened.
    riser 2 barb b.jpg - one thread engages (with NPT, 4-1/2 threads should engage at hand tight.)
    riser 2 plug a.jpg - 3/4" plug marked at hand tightened.
    riser 2 plug b.jpg - one thread engages (again, 4-1/2 NPT threads should engage at hand tight.)

Please advise what's going on with Westerbeke and its castings?

#35
Main Message Board / M-35B / sailor Michael
June 10, 2017, 12:45:44 PM
 Michael,

Welcome, and thank you for putting your boat information in the post.   It's good also if in your forum profile you put your boat information and engine information so that it shows up on the sidebar of the forum post.

It looks like what you have there is an M-30B.   So you should look at service bulletins that specifically referenced that engine.

the alternator bracket upgrade was  for the older series engines, the new B-series have no issue with  the alternator bracket.

I see that you have the Sherwood  seawater pump, you might want to search the forum, and the tech wiki site for articles on the Sherwood versus Oberdorfer pump for the B series engines.
JTSO  there is no comparison  in quality between the two, and you might want to think about upgrading to an OB.

One issue that is prevalent in ALL B series engines is that the low oil pressure switch (mounted on a bracket , Port side, under the starter) is subject to the terminal tabs breaking off. This will happen, it's just a question of when not if. The reason is Westerbeke used stiff auto wire instead of fine-stranded marine wire for its harnesses.  Thus vibration and movement in the harness breaks one or two tabs off the oil pressure switch.  That's documented on the forum also if you do a search for it.   There's a couple ways to fix this, one of which is to cut the wires back and crimp but crimp on fine stranded wire to the terminals so that it's flexible, and then make sure that the harness is well zip tied so that there's no relative movement/vibration  between the harness and switch. (i.e.,  The engine, harness, and switch all vibrate together. )

Another issue is, there was an SB for the B-series engines to ensure that it there is a reinforcing ring on the gear shaft that drives the seawater pump  another issue is, there was an SB for the B-series engines to ensure that it there is a reinforcing ring on the gear shaft that drives the seawater pump.    I believe that pertains to the 35-B in addition to the 25-XPB. You can check that SB against your engine serial number/date, but to check it for sure you remove the pump and look at the end of the shaft with a flashlight. You'll see whether there's a reinforcing ring on the outside of the fork  that drives the sea water pump.

The reason for that reinforcing ring, is due to the Sherwood pump. The iron body will seize up if not maintained "daily" as Wb recommends. In fact rather than put a decent pump on there they had to put a reinforcing ring on the shift so that when the pump seized, it doesn't crack the split on the fork.  When you're on here  you'll see me say this  enough times that you may get sick of it but, "typical Westerbeke".

Leslie be sure not to confuse anything you read on here about 35 or 35A with your 35B -- they are absolutely completely different engines.
If you were crankcase breather hose is cut at an angle and zip tied to your air intake, open parentheses again, typical Westerbeke) you can connect it directly to the intake or intake manifold by a few different methods.

There's probably more on that engine that I'll think of later.

Cheers and good luck with the survey,
Ken
#36
(PARAPHRASED)

Quote

The Kubota Parts Manual for the M-25XPB is on the TechWiki under "Manuals".  Page 24 shows the closed coolant pump. The M-35BC should fit the same pump as the M-25XPB.

The current Kubota p/n is 16241-73034, available from a Kubota dealer, or online at www.messicks.com, or online at Kumar Brothers.
Kumar is not Kubota OEM parts, but they are cheaper and I have NOT heard of Kumar problems.




Quote

To clarify, "Kubota manual for the M-25XPB engine" means the manual for the Kubota "cousin engine" of the "Universal XPB," which is a Kubota D-1005.

One "cousin engine" for the M-35B, is the Kubota V1305.
I just now uploaded the manual to the TechWiki site for you. The p/n for that engine is 16251-73032 and 16251-73034.  (They may have different impellers)



Quote

A problem sometimes occurs getting parts out of the Kubota manual when it shows two or three different part numbers depending upon the Kubota engine serial number.  The Universal serial number is different than the Kubota serial number.



Quote

BTW, on page 18 of the D-1005 manual, you'll see a knock-out on the intake manifold, to the right of the air intake tube.  Kubota p/n 16241-05550 (on page 39 of the V1305 manual,) fits into the knockout hole and you can connect the crankcase breather hose there, instead of zip-tying it alongside the foam "filter" as Wb does.


#37
All M-25, XP, 35 owners (maybe others) -  Just an FYI if you have been having charging issues.

In doing a panel/harness rebuild, I ran across a Universal OEM engine harness that had the wrong alternator field excite configuration.  The alternator field excite circuit is simply a solid 12vdc applied from the cockpit panel to wake up the alternator so that it starts charging at low RPM.

The cockpit harness had been done correctly from Seaward/Bristol/CTY factory, but the engine end of the harness (engine side of the gummy bear plug, i.e., what is connected to the engine components) was WRONG.

The 51-amp / 55-amp 8MRxxxx model Motorola alternators that were used on most above engines have a YELLOW field excite wire terminating in a BLACK plastic slide-on terminal cover (technically called a Delphi Packard 56 connector -- see lower center of pic below, your wire/connector may be painted over as shown.) The PURPLE harness wire (the excite wire originates at the ignition key switch on the panel) mates with the Packard 56 connector.

This OEM Universal engine harness had its field excite wire terminated in a ring terminal.  So on the assembly line, when the harness was connected to the engine there was no Packard terminal to plug into the alternator connector -- consequently the harness wire was "mistakenly" put onto the tachometer (A/C output) terminal post (or maybe the give-a-crap ratio was very low that day, and it was done knowingly rather than switching the terminals. I mean really, techs know if there's a yellow excite wire, it gets hooked up.)  I could tell that the harness wire and ring terminal were OEM, so the SNAFU was at the Universal factory, not by a P.O.

The effect is that, at low RPM, the alternator will not excite and charge -- I also don't see how the tachometer could register correctly with a solid 12v DC applied to the 12v AC signal.  If you are having charge and/or tach issues, you might first check to see if your harness excite wire is properly connected.

Some of the alternators that Universal used (i.e., 72 amp) had post-type excite terminals on the back of the regulator, so I suspect that this was simply a mix up of using the wrong engine harness (for 72 amp) on an engine that had an (51/55 amp) alternator looking for a Packard-type connector.

kk
#38
Quote from: kwaltersmi on May 05, 2017, 05:33:03 PM
I launched today with my M25 XPB and the Sherwood pump is leaking. After opening it up to check the impeller, it looks like the rubber on the seal (Parts 10 through 12 - 30288X) was torn and was coming out.  It dripped about 1 drop every 2 seconds at idle on launch, but quit dripping altogether once I was underway for the 3 mile motor to my marina. No dripping when I arrived at my dock.

So...

Should I replace the seal in the Sherwood pump?  Is this difficult to do?  Should I swap in the Oberdorfer (is it 908?) pump instead? Should I leave it alone and wait for it to leak again even though part of the rubber from the seal came out of the pump when I opened prior to motoring to my marina?

There's only one "correct" answer.... YBYC, but.......... see below if you even consider keeping a pump that is designed to seize up...
#39
Main Message Board / 1990 sea cock and hose sizes?
April 10, 2017, 05:07:55 PM
I am trying to determine the sea cock and hose/hose barb sizes,  I checked the MK-1 manual, but the layout of the thru hulls doesn't indicate any sea cock thread or hose/hose barb sizes.

Can anyone help me fill in a few of these blanks?:

Are the Marelon raw water, sink, head, etc, sea cocks all 3/4" thread?
Hose size, sea cock to strainer?
Inlet and outlet thread size?  3/4"?
Galley sink drain hose size?
Head inlet and sink drain hose sizes?

Thanks for ANY help!
Ken
#40
Ok, so on the new LCD Hour Meter/Tach combos, the HM is advanced via the tach signal, not just by being powered by 12v (this results in true "engine run" hours, instead of "tach powered-up" hours.)

So there's no way to advance a replacement tach to match the engine hours.   :cry4`  or is there?  ....maybe......   :donno:

Would, seeing that the alternator sends a 12v A/C signal, would hooking the tach to a step-down 120 vac to 12 vac wall-plug-in transformer advance the hour meter?  The current in the tach signal wire is low, and I see 12 vac wall-plug transformers that can supply up to 5 amps AC.

Does anyone have any knowledge (that would make you an aficionado) or experience with this?

How's that for an oddball?   :?:

Ken
#41
Main Message Board / Wiring Harness, again
February 02, 2017, 06:28:12 PM
Just sharing a harness I got in -- attached to a panel to do some work on. 

Pic 1 is the gummy bear behind the panel -- looked pretty good, not pristine, but not bad.   :D
The engine end had already been clipped and butt crimped together.   :thumb:

So the panel connector didn't need to be eliminated, right?  No corrosion or melting, right?   :D

I couldn't even pull the connector apart -- it was like welded together.  I had to cut it open.   :?

Pic 2 are the male ends, corroded, burned bullet terminals on the power conductor, charge conductor (still had the ammeter, not voltmeter,) and the alteranator excite.   .  I don't see how that engine EVER started or the alternator field excited, or the batteries EVER charged.   :shock: :shock: :shock:

PLEASE PLEASE, anyone who hasn't already -- look at the 101 topics and read about doing away with the gummy bear plugs -- the boat you save might be your own.

kk
#42
Stu Jackson:

--- Quote from: Bill Shreeves on Today at 07:21:38 AM ---Stu - As you suggested, I'll leave the gearbox unpainted and use Boeshield T9 to protect it.  I'll also use it to protect my new stuffing box as suggested on another site.  I'm assuming your dislike of silicone is in reference to silicone caulk as a sealant?

--- End quote ---

Silicone can be a good sealant.  I just rebedded my traveler track after 16 or 17 years, not too bad, right?  Wrong.  Silicone is a bear to remove.  If I used butyl tape 17 years ago, I would not have had to redo it, it would still be dry down below.

Port gaskets?  Ask the vendors: Beckson and Lewmar.  The Beckson website is full of very good info.

Bill Shreeves:
WOW! did that take a left turn and go 'round the block...  All good stuff guys, I learn so much every time I read a post or ask a question.

Stu - As you suggested, I'll leave the gearbox unpainted and use Boeshield T9 to protect it.  I'll also use it to protect my new stuffing box as suggested on another site.  I'm assuming your dislike of silicone is in reference to silicone caulk as a sealant?

Ken - I used a liberal amount of 50/50 Tranny Fluid/Acetone as a penetrating oil on my prop and coupling a week before attempting removal.  I was somewhat careful not to get the mix on the tranny I am removing and anything else.  I've read a number of times that mix is much more effective as a penetrating oil than most off-the shelf penetrating oils including WD40, PB Blaster and Kroil.

Breakin' Away - So, I just looked up the WD40 Ingredients and it looks like the predominant ingredient is mineral oil.  Either way, I've not been a fan of WD40 for two reasons.  1. I've never thought it was a very good penetrating oil 2. I hate the way it smells and it seems to linger forever.   The last thing I want to do is introduce yet another smell on the boat and will try alternatives.  With that in mind, would mineral oil be useful in restoring port gaskets?

Stu Jackson:

--- Quote from: Breakin Away on Yesterday at 04:55:17 PM
Where did you find the mineral oil contents re WD40?  Link please?

K


---.
--- Quote from: Stu Jackson on Yesterday at 10:28:35 AM ---No need to paint it, Bill. Paint traps heat, right?   But throw away the WD40.  I think of it as silicone (only place to use it is on the Beckson ports).  Get Boeshield T9 for that use, and PB Blaster to remove stubborn nuts & bolts.
#43
This (an IC30A member) Chuck Eckman did when powering w/a Beta.  It may or may not work w the 34, but I thought it was pretty cool.  Both PDF and jpgs attached.

His post:

I repowered last year with a Beta-20. One of the tricks the dealer taught me greatly simplified the install & alignment. I made a simple "simulator" using 2" wide x 3/4" thick plywood screwed together in an "airplane" shape. The center stick was the total length of the engine/trans. The "wings" were long enough to correctly position your motor mounts. At the tranny end I added a piece of 2x4 that was sized to indicate the center of the prop shaft. Having measured the prop angle I was able to mount the motor mounts to the simulator and use it to position and pre-adjust the mounts to the correct height. Once everything was as close is I could get it I transferred the mounts to the motor and lifted everything in place. Once position I went through the alignment several times with a couple days in between to allow things to settle BEFORE I screwed the mounts in place. Once the mounts were screwed down I had to make some minor adjustments but I avoided having to relocate anything. I'll see if I can locate a picture of the setup but I killed the phone between then and now and may have lost the pic. If so I'll sketch something up. Good luck!

ken
#44
What a (IC30A member) Chuck Erkman did when he repowered w/ a Beta -- may or may not be useful to y'all but I thought it was interesting.....

For simplicity I'll just quote him below
Ken

I repowered last year with a Beta-20. One of the tricks the dealer taught me greatly simplified the install & alignment. I made a simple "simulator" using 2" wide x 3/4" thick plywood screwed together in an "airplane" shape. The center stick was the total length of the engine/trans. The "wings" were long enough to correctly position your motor mounts. At the tranny end I added a piece of 2x4 that was sized to indicate the center of the prop shaft. Having measured the prop angle I was able to mount the motor mounts to the simulator and use it to position and pre-adjust the mounts to the correct height. Once everything was as close is I could get it I transferred the mounts to the motor and lifted everything in place. Once position I went through the alignment several times with a couple days in between to allow things to settle BEFORE I screwed the mounts in place. Once the mounts were screwed down I had to make some minor adjustments but I avoided having to relocate anything. I'll see if I can locate a picture of the setup but I killed the phone between then and now and may have lost the pic. If so I'll sketch something up. Good luck!
#45
This something (an IC30A member) Chuck Erkman did when repowering -- may or may not be useful to 34s, but I thought it an interesting approach...

I'll just quote him for simplicity....

I repowered last year with a Beta-20. One of the tricks the dealer taught me greatly simplified the install & alignment. I made a simple "simulator" using 2" wide x 3/4" thick plywood screwed together in an "airplane" shape. The center stick was the total length of the engine/trans. The "wings" were long enough to correctly position your motor mounts. At the tranny end I added a piece of 2x4 that was sized to indicate the center of the prop shaft. Having measured the prop angle I was able to mount the motor mounts to the simulator and use it to position and pre-adjust the mounts to the correct height. Once everything was as close is I could get it I transferred the mounts to the motor and lifted everything in place. Once position I went through the alignment several times with a couple days in between to allow things to settle BEFORE I screwed the mounts in place. Once the mounts were screwed down I had to make some minor adjustments but I avoided having to relocate anything. I'll see if I can locate a picture of the setup but I killed the phone between then and now and may have lost the pic. If so I'll sketch something up. Good luck!

ken
#46
Quote from: mark_53 on November 30, 2016, 05:04:58 PM
Quote from: Capt.Jim on November 26, 2016, 06:04:26 PM

Just curious...

When Honda Goldwings in the early 2000s found out that mainframe cracks were appearing they were recalled.
Is there such a thing happened with Catalina @ Woodlands Hill ever?

I mean after all isn't this a production/engineering defect ?

Excellent question for a judge to decide.  Hire a lawyer, pay him/her big$$$$ and take it to court and let us know. On the other hand you can fix it and move on.
Another option would be to call Catalina Yachts and ask them to fix the defect on your 30 year old boat.  Hang up if the chuckling lasts more than a minute.


Caution: A long story, specifically a personal experience, re: CTY design/engineering, customer relations, etc ---
Please hit "delete" if this is TMI or you can't deal with my unabashed negative attitude about CTY, based on personal experience.


When I fixed my 1984 C-30's bad keel joint ~20 yrs ago (again she was somewhere < 9 yrs old when the fairing crack in the fairing and keel joint water leak surfaced.  I was young and dumb (now I'm old and more dumb) and was aware of neither the wood plank nor the keel bedding material. 

So, I gathered as much info as I blindly could -- talked to Gougeon Bros and other C-30 owners.  And then, Frank -- about what I was seeing, its cause, etc. 

I didn't blame CTY or asked or expected CTY to pay for it or to have my yard fix it.  To understand "why" this happened (i.e., the engineer's approach) I was looking for guidance (that's all I wanted.)   Other's guidance (to fix it correctly and permanently) was "drop the lead, grind away all polyester resin bedding, and rebed the keel/stub joint w/ 5200."

Speaking with Frank, his helpfulness was (paraphrased) 'whaddayah want?  It's a 10-year-old boat.  If you want a perfect boat I can sell you a new 30.' 

Nice customer relations.

I chalk it up to just being defensive for f*'n up the design/engineering, wood-in-the-stub in the first place -- or maybe just a bad day in Woodland Hills  -- again, I don't know, nor back then, didn't view the joint deterioration as a design flaw.   I don't know what year the CTY-generated fixes came out, but nary an offer from Frank to fax the keel repair document (it was issued in Feb '96 and I spoke w/ Frank in April.)  I did later obtain the fix on the joint itself, but not the method/procedure to remove the wooden plank (otherwise I would have removed it and not just fixed the joint while I had the keel off and bolts out of the way.)

Not one suggestion (or caution) how to approach this repair, or guidance on dropping the keel, or cautions thereof offered.

Fast forward to the actual work....  Before doing anything the boat (in its cradle) was very precisely leveled and the keel checked for plumb (just the engineer again gathering more, rather than less data  -- rather than after (ooops too late.))    Hmmmm......  the keel was actually bolted up off-plumb, tipped to starboard.  I recall it being an inch or two off at the base.  NOT good!!??!!  Right? (the engineer says.)

I measured it precisely, and visual evidence further confirmed it (after grinding off all fairing, the keel joint on the port side was 3/8"+ wide, while on the stbd side was narrower -- like 1/4" -- as I said before, I used my long, 1/4" electrician bit to drill into the joint laterally, and the bit was actually scarfing the top surface of lead on the stbd side while there was ample margin on the port side.) 

hmmmmm......  I need to "improve on" the CTY workmanship when bolting this back up, right?  (again the engineer.)

So, LONG  repair story shortened -- after cleaning up the mating surfaces -- boat and lead precisely checked after loosely bolting up, the lead precisely positioned dead-on plumb -- 5200'd, bolted up and, after some curing, hand tightened, and finally torqued to spec, bla bla bla.

The (Bada bing) big reveal to the story...
Back in the water and for the 20 years since I have lived with the dreaded Catalina C-30 port list, which (I found out afterward) plagued the early C-30s. 

Nice, thank you for your guidance Frank. 
My bad for overthinking the work (or not thinking it through enough.)  And I don't blame CTY for bolting up later keels "canted" to offset the off-center-of-weight design on the C-30.  Just f*'n cooperate with an owner who asks for guidance (even if need to make them promise "Don't tell anyone else what we did to fix it.")  And don't deny again and again and again (are you still with CTY, David?) after long ago reading online my absolutely precise description of the CTY canted keel bolt up, how the historic C-30 port list magically "disappeared" in later years, and what happened as a result of Frank's helpful customer relations.  A "Gee, we regret this happened," would ease the pain, but then Frank's lawyers would have a heart attack.

So, among other reasons ... Why my distaste for CTY's engineering/design mistakes, and Frank in particular? Go figure.

So before all the "CTY is wonderful" die-hards blast this, AGAIN, this experience has NOTHING to do with Catalinas being GREAT boats for the money, them being production boats so therefore NOT perfect, and normal s**t happening during design/manufacturing.  All I expected (in retrospect)  -- just a little fess up, own what you did wrong, and be helpful to your customers.  So I have to blame myself and realize that Frank had no actual requirement to be either helpful or honest with me in particular -- I wasn't Frank's "customer" -- the PO was of course his customer. 

JTSO and I'm entitled to it.  But, regardless (or in spite of Frank) I still love Catalinas (I just don't love CTY as a company) --

-ken


#47
Those with M-25s NOT XPs)
check out this Practical Sailor article.
  :shock: :shock:




http://www.sailmagazine.com/multihulls/cruising-multihulls/engine-trouble-sams-dead/?utm_source=sail-enewsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_content=textlink&utm_campaign=enewsletter

We with M-25s also have an external oil hose that can fail (well, I used to have one.) If you have an original M-25, there's a rubber/fabric oil hose leading from the oil port on the block (nestled in above the starter motor, below the exhaust manifold) to a machined block (mounted on the Hx bracket) that holds the low-oil-pressure-alarm switch.  The hose can fail from age and engine heat, and cause a mess -- no less an engine failure.  I caught mine because I noticed questionable oil pressure (it was oozing oil and had not completely failed.) There is a second hole in the machined oil block that is tapped 1/8" NPT.

There's no need for this hose, and who knows what quality material Universal used for it (it is not OE Kubota.)  There reason to have the oil switch away from the engine block and doing so introduces one more unnecessary failure point on the M-25s.

The OEM oil switch by the Hx is 1/8"-27 NPT thread (so it's an "American" pressure switch.)  The same thread as on the engine block 1/8"-28 JIS (so it's takes a Japanese/Kubota thread switch -- the same switch that is on the M-25XPs, in the on-the-block location.)  The only downside of that location is its access (see switch visible in attached pic -- looking straight down between the valve cover and exh manifold.) I extended mine out past the exhaust manifold (and also added a sender for a real oil pressure gauge in the cockpit panel.)

Take 10 minutes to check if you have the OE hose (#11), and block and rear-mounted oil switch (#20, #14), and decide whether it's worth taking the chance for that hose to fail or to eliminate it before it does. 


The on-engine-block switch (#28) is p/n 299964 (Westerbeke, $24) or 15841-39010 (Kubota, $18.)




-kk
#48
Main Message Board / Westerbeke Service Bulletins
September 16, 2016, 08:16:15 PM
I just uploaded the service bulletins (that I know of) that pertain to the M25, XP, and B-series engines to the techwiki -- they are on the Manuals  page.

-kk
#49
Main Message Board / Garhauer KUDOS
May 09, 2016, 04:47:04 PM
So I needed (2) 3 over 3 and (2) 2 over 2 size 40 deck organizers for a refit and called in @ 10:00 PST. 

Naturally with my luck, at 12 PST, Kelly called to confirm that none, NONE! of that was in stock.  Arrrrgh!  What to do now?  I'm DEAD!
But Dawn had already started building what I needed - so Kelly expected they could overnight it on Wednesday.  Great! <whew>  Wow saved my butt.

And then Kelly called @ 3:30 PST to say, 'We're all done and can get them out today, no need to overnight it.")   Like now.  TODAY.

Who else provides that kind of customer service ????????  Without even having to ask for it!!!

Kudos Garhauer.  Kudos.   :clap :clap :clap :clap
#50
Quote from: Noah on May 01, 2016, 09:44:27 AM
The PRIMARY filter (whether it be a Racor spin-on or 500 series turbine drop-in, or Dahl, etc.) is generally under the head sink and should be a 2 micron. Although Maine Sail recommened against this in boats where you are uncertain of fuel/tank quality.  The SECONDARY filter is the spin-on filter on the engine. This is generally 10-30 microns and can be a variety of brands, not necessarily Racor. Do I have this correct?

Quote from: Jon W on May 01, 2016, 08:28:01 AM
They recommend it for marine applications, but not as the primary filter element.


Noah,
Exactly.  Thread de-hijacked also!
"Should be" a 2u is, I think, a YBYC, IIWMB, etc. -- but am interested in Racor's position on this (marine specifically, not other environments.) I had posted the efficiencies of various brand secondary filters on the TW.  But, they can be misleading because being engine-mounted they'll most likely be less than "lab condition" efficient.  By rights, both filters belong off the vibrating engine, but...

k

Jon,
Mea culpa -- sometimes I tend to abbreviate too much.  What I was getting at was -- there's a difference between a 2u primary in a marine environment v a 2u primary in other environments.  So I was surprised that Racor favored 10u primary for that use.  I haven't seen the beta rations for the 10u, so can't say what the "real" efficiency is, discounting Racor's marketing/branding.  Wonder how much better than my secondary filter (82% efficient @ 10u; 98.67% efficient @ 20u.)

I don't think the installation instructions, etc.. are on the TW -- do you have a link to those recommendations and I'll post them with my racor literature so all have them.

Thanks,
k