Messages

Keith,

I may be able to help you here. I can find a Barr Marine part for the same at a much better price than the Universal one. I have spoken to my contacts at a local Westerbeke dealer where I have an account and have gotten some information on the same. Please PM me and send me your contact information so I can call you. Let me see if I can help you here.

Cheers.

I agree with Peyton. The Exhaust manifold is a universal part and you will not be able to get it from Kubota. In case of Kubota, while using the engine in the tractors they have a fan mounted on the pulley and a radiator in front of the fan to provide the cooling. Universal marinized the engine and added the Exhaust manifold and the Heat Exchanger etc. for cooling purposes.

The Universal Exhaust Manifold for M25 is part number 301014. I will try and attach the two pages from the M25 parts list for easy reference.

Keith,

I did a quick search and found the manifold at the following places:

http://shop.torresen.com/ships_store/index.php?p=details&mfc=Universal&sku=301014
http://www.marinepartssource.com/newdetails.asp?mfg=Universal&pnumber=uJHW301014
http://www.clrmarine.com/216.html?psid=c5c98247eb2633d0

I agree with Stu, unless you want to spend the 'close to $1500' for the new one, your best bet is finding a used one from someone who is parting out a M25. I would just post a 'wanted' ad on a few of the forums and see if someone bites.

You have already removed the manifold and confirmed a small leak so any kind of gasket related issues are out of the picture at this point. It is a simple manifold. Could you take it to a local workshop and have them weld and plug the leak? The pressures are not too high inside the manifold. Probably not greater than 14 psi as that is the rating for the cap. hence a welding repair could hold well, in my opinion. Just some thoughts. In your place I would definitely explore that option. That is in case one is able to pin point the leak of course.

Hope that helps.

Stu,

I agree with you. Hence the comment on we need to turn down the pressure (better said - flow) using a fitting such as the one Maine Sail has described. I have a brass one that came with my garden hose nozzle set.

Here is what I do mostly. Take the hose from my 'raw water flush' and put it in a bucket. Fill the bucket half or so. Put the garden hose from the dock water in the bucket having the flow regulator on it to be able to turn on the water and regulate the flow right from the cabin. Then I start the engine normally with the through hull stop cock open and the engine taking raw water from the sea. Then almost simultaneously, I turn off the stop cock on the through hull and turn on the valve on the T to take the water from the bucket. Then I have my partner check to see the water is coming out of the exhaust as it should. I quickly turn on the regulator at the end of the water hose and regulate the flow so as to keep the level in the bucket steady and about half full. So long as you don't rev the engine, the level of the water in the bucket will remain about the same. If you increase the rpm, the engine will use more water and the level in the bucket will start going down. If you want to stay at the higher rpm you can increase the flow from the garden hose. Remember to decrease it when you decrease the rpm again or the level of water in the bucket will rise and may overflow into your cabin...

This is essentially the method we used in my garage with the M25 when you visited me...

I created a fresh water flush mechanism by adding a (T) fitting between my through hull and the raw water strainer. The output of the strainer goes to the input of the raw water pump on the engine. I converted the end of the T so I could connect a garden hose to it. The purpose of this fresh water flush system is to allow for easy flushing of the raw water passages including the HE with fresh water while at the dock. I also added another ball valve in this circuit so while the engine is running at idle, I can close the through hull stop cock and open the valve to the hose and switch from sea water to fresh water. This is a bit more convenient than the use of the bucket since we can run the engine longer by connecting the hose. You do need to remember to turn down the pressure of the water in the garden hose as that may be quite a bit depending on the location. This mechanism can also be used with the bucket of water and will not require removing the hose from the through hull stop cock.

I am taking some friends out for a sail this weekend. I can take and post a picture if it is of interest to people here. Although the fresh water flush is pretty common and many of you may already have something like it.

Hi Bob,

Rather than fill the bilge with a garden hose, I would suggest removing the pump and placing/holding it in a bucket that half (or less) full of water. If the pump has a inbuilt switch lower the pump into the bucket till it works. If the float switch is outside, operate the same and have the pump recycle the water in the bucket for s little while. That will allow you to do what you want without puring all that water in your bilge. Just an idea.

In my case, I had a Rule 1100 pump that has a built in switch. The pump started working intermittently so I opened it up and cleaned the float cylinder properly and it has been behaving since. The reason for the sticking was that some oil had leaked from my pressure sender into the bilge and that was making the float switch stick. That was my root cause, yours may be slightly different.

Cory,

I second that sentiment. Great idea  .

Could you post a link to the online store where you purchased the oil separator?

Thanks.

Hi Cliff,
It would help if you post a picture. I having a hard time visualizing the line making a 90 deg turn after leaving the furling drum...Also not sure how it will help switching to STA. Generally things are laterally symmetrical, so you may end up having the same issue on STA side...

If you post a picture we may be able to help better. Just my thoughts.

Mark,

The muffler (the black FG thingy your mention) has two hoses connected to it. The IN comes from the engine output, through what is called the exhaust riser. The exhaust riser is the insulated thing connected from the back on the engine to the IN of the muffler. There is a water input going into the exhaust riser that comes from the HE (Heat Exchanger) and connects to this exhaust riser. The second connection on the muffler is usually vertical and that ultimately goes to the exhaust output at the back of the boat.

There are two main hoses in this section of the exhaust system:

1. Going down from the other side of the exhaust riser to the muffler IN. This is where the 'hump hose' that Ron has talked about can go. You need to measure the length of the hose needed so you can order the appropriate hump hose from Catalina direct.
2. Going from the muffler OUT to the boat exhaust. This usually is a long one piece exhaust (could be different in disparate boats)

I would suggest you check which one of these two is leaking for you on the muffler side. It may as well be that the clamps are loose and you can check it my tightening the clamps. It could also be that the input sections (also called nipples) on the FG muffler are damaged and therefore are leaking. If tightening of the clamps does not help you then you have to check the muffler input nipples. To do that you will need to pull out the hoses. As you have gathered, that could be difficult given how old they are and so on. After checking these things you can decide if you want to replace the hose going from Exhaust riser to muffler IN with a blue hump hose. Note the hump hose is not going to help your leak (unless by chance that specific hose on your boat is damaged), it will just help against the engine vibration damaging the muffler input nipples that can happen by using a hard walled hose in place of the soft silicone hump hose. Yes, the hump hose also will help reduce the transmition of the engine vibration to the hull.

I found a schematic that may help you understand the above better. See the attached drawing for C34. Item 5 is the nipple in the exhaust riser. Item 6 called 'flex' is where the hump hose goes. Item 10 is the other hose going from muffler to exhaust.

Hope that helps. Post if you still have questions and the good people on this forum will help.

Hi Ken,

Thanks! It is always good when a project turns out right. Attached is another photo of the drink holder.

Yes, your idea can work well for the wine glasses. In fact if one can make such a support from say 1/2" closed cell foam that is stiff enough then, one can have a easily removable base for the wine glasses. One can cut a thin slit on the sides where the support can slide/snap on the bails and will stay there to support the glass. Two issues though with that idea - first, not sure how this will hold up on the sailboat were the inclination keeps changing (heel!), second, this won't provide support for the thin stem of the traditional wine glass. However if you can use the standard shaped plastic glass for wine, this holder will work. Even without the support we have discussed. You know the plastic transparent glasses that are the disposable types? If you are flexible with your use of 'china' it may work. What do you think?

I'd love to know more about the Edson one that your friend has. Is it teak or white Teflon type? Would you know how much your friend paid for the same? I am curious.

Keep the comments coming. I learn more from the comments from you than by the making...:-)

I recently made a drink holder using teak to fit my Edson pedestal. I thought I would share with the good people of this forum.

Background:

• I was already opening up the pedestal to add the clutch control and hence removing the compass and the engine control assy
• I was also going to be putting in a new cable to the clutch control since the old one for the A4 was too thick and unnecessary

Given that I was doing the above and would have to make the adjustments for the clutch and throttle levers, I thought it was a good time to make the drink holder.

Location:

I did not have any fixed drink holders in the cockpit, this drink holder that would fit just below the engine control assy would be a good addition. It would be out of the way from the traffic in the cockpit and reasonably close for the crew not to mention the helmsperson.

Fabrication:

I used a 3/4 teak wood. Here are the high level steps I followed, more or less in the right sequence:

1. Having decided that I would have 4 holes, 2 on each side and based on the size of my steering wheel, I decided to keep the total width of the holder to about 24"
2. I traced the bottom of the engine control assy in the center so as to know where to drill and mill.
3. I used the diameter of a beer bottle and a soft drink can as a sample and decided the size of the holes. Smaller one on the outside.
4. I used a scrolling jigsaw to cut the center portion. This was difficult and needed a lot of creativity
5. I used holesaws to cut the holes for the drinks
6. Since I did not want to keep the whole 3/4" of width of the teak (worried that it would mess with the distance available for the engine controls), I decided to mill the center portion down to 1/2". This was very difficult to do with the tools in my garage. I don't have a router so I put the router bit I had on a benchtop drillpress and used that to mill the center portion.
7. I oversized the holes for the 4 engine control mounting bolts so that they could allow for slight discrepancy in the measurements.
8. I used another curved router bit on my drill press and curved the edges of the drink holder. Caution: This is tricky. I will suggest caution and rather that people use a proper router, or just do it by hand. We don't need too much of a curve here, just enough to take the edge off, in my opinion
9. For the bails I used a 1/8" solid brass rod and bent it to the required shape using a simple benchtop vise. The bails I fixed to the underside using a simple SS screw and a SS flat washer. Before fitting the bails I used a Dremel type rotary tool to create small groove so the end of the bail where the screw was attached would stay put and not slide from side to side. the bails were finally attached after varnish was done and complete.
10. After the drink holder was structurally complete, I sanded it nicely and applied 5 coats of Ephiphanes varnish. People can use any varnish they are used to. I have used Epiphanes on my combing and like the finish it provides on the teak.
11. Once the varnish was complete and dry, I attached the bails on the underside.
12. The drink holder was fitted first on the pedestal, then went the engine control assy ( the cylindrical white thingy that holds the control levers), then went the 1/4-20 screws. Since I had replaced my old engine control assy with a new one (slightly bigger height), and the added 1/2" of width for the drink holder, I had to use longer screws. In my case I went for 4" screws. These I got from Svendsens. You can easily get them from a HW store. You will need to use SS screws of course.
13. Then followed the connections of the engine control cable, cable holder, and their adjustments. The adjustment instructions are provided by Edson and are quite detailed. That is a topic of another note, so I will not details those here in the drink holder fabrication section.
14. Lastly I fitted the compass and the compass cover. Since I had the compass out (and also because I dropped the light bulb in the pedestal!) I opted to go for the newer Led lights. I got those from Richtie, through Svendsens.

Sorry I was able to attach only one photo given the 150KB limit.

I really love how the drink holder turned out. Let me have your comments and also questions if any. Cheers.

Paul,

I don't think this is related to your problem, but I came across something interesting in another forum.. The water pump in question was an Oberdorfer, however the engine was an A4.

The sailor found that the new impeller was slightly smaller in 'width/thickness' than the original one. See the attached photo.

I found it very interesting and thought I would share it with you and this forum. Such a thing could result in lower water flow. Again as I said, this may not be your issue, just related information. I also believe it is a different kind of Oberdorfer pump for the A4.

Paul,

Somehow I feel that your problem may not lie in the raw water input section. You indicated that you are getting the water coming out of the exhaust and that it increases with rpm. That makes me feel you have a problem somewhere else. Interestingly you say that the problem was created after you rebuilt the pump and before rebuilding your pump the engine was working fine...

Perhaps you could try uninstalling and reinstalling the pump. You should also check what dgill has just suggested. I don't know about the long and short screws, and don't understand the reasoning for the same so cannot infer whether that could be an issue. Ron will be able to help with that.

I would just recheck everything that you touched while doing the rebuild of the pump. Sorry don't seem to be of much help to you...

Tom,

You missed the following text from my last para.."Although this picture is not that of an Oberdorfer pump that you have, I hope this helps you determine your input nipple"....

Hi Paul,

I agree with Stu, you could have problems if you have scoring on your face plate. However, you seem to have a more 'severe' issue than that could be caused by scoring. Also given that you recently rebuilt it I am assuming you would have noticed scoring on the face plate if there was some. Clearly as noticed by you, you may have a simple issue of crossed hoses. Ken has provided the correct comment that the water flow in the water pump depends on the direction of rotation. Since you know the direction of rotation of your pump (or can check that pretty easily). Here is a generic explanation that may help.

As always a picture is worth a thousand words. Attached is a picture of a water pump shell I stole from Main Sail's website for illustration. In this case if the impeller is rotating clockwise the nipple on the right would be input. If the impeller was rotating anticlockwise (as seen from the front of the picture) the nipple on the left would be the input. Basically, depending on the direction of rotation, the nipple that precedes a longer traversal for the water before reaching the next nipple, would be the input. This allows the impeller to collect a volume of water before shoving it into the HE.

I am sure Stu and Ken will chime in if my explanation is incorrect. Although this picture is not that of an Oberdorfer pump that you have, I hope this helps you determine your input nipple. Cheers.

Paul,

A quick check would be to see if you are getting water coming out of the exhaust while the engine is running. If you are, then the hoses are connected correctly. If not, or very little, switch them and check.