below is an image of medium grit rubbing compound, on my blue paint, that a friend decided to do, to show me how dirty my boat is and how oxidized the paint is. the problem is, so much blue came off that it gummed up the buffer. I bought
Star brite Premium Cleaner Wax with PTEF to use on my boat, before he did this but i realize i should clean the boat, then use the buffer so as to not gum it up. is the Cleaner/wax okay to use, before the buffing compound or should i use something else, in this special case?
thanks
becki kain
becki,
YES!!! The boat should be clean, otherwise you're compounding the easily-removable removable dirt into the gel coat.
JTSO, others' mileage may differ:
A cleaner/wax is the worst of both worlds. Would you take a shower, save the water, and rinse off using the same water with all the dirt you took off?? If you want to really save time, just mix the rubbing compound into the cleaner/wax -- and apply all at once.
The BEST I've found -- BY FAR, (JTSO, OMMV) is Collinite fiberglass cleaner, and Collinite Boat Wax (Insulator Wax is the same product at a lower price.) Not the Fleetwax (cleaner/wax.)
By hand on a small section, try the least abrasive compound first, even just the Collinite cleaner, before going to a more aggressive grit. You'll be very sorry of you burn through the colored gel coat (it happens) with the wrong compound and/or buffer.
Using a buffer takes the RIGHT one, with the RIGHT SPEED, and experience. Otherwise, do it by hand. You have to compound differently than polishing. If the buffer is caking up when compounding, you may have the wrong buffer. A variable speed buffer is best for multiple uses.
kk
Quote from: KWKloeber on April 21, 2017, 08:05:17 AM
1. A cleaner/wax is the worst of both worlds. Would you take a shower, save the water, and rinse off using the same water with all the dirt you took off?? If you want to really save time, just mix the rubbing compound into the cleaner/wax -- and apply all at once.
2. The BEST I've found -- BY FAR, (JTSO, OMMV) is Collinite fiberglass cleaner, and Collinite Boat Wax (Insulator Wax is the same product at a lower price.) Not the Fleetwax (cleaner/wax.)
1. Too true.
2. Yes. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
becki,
Here's the Holy Grail:
https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/tips-for-a-great-buff-wax.117266/
by Maine Sail
Quote from: Stu Jackson on April 21, 2017, 08:09:17 AM
2. Yes. :thumb: :thumb: :thumb:
becki,
I'll relay a true experience from 1994....
When we bought the C30, we cleaned, prepped, and waxed her while she was still on the hard (actually before the deal closed, but that's another story.) It took a while to get the vinyl guy arranged, so he applied the graphics after she was in the slip.
He apologized for needing to use his super-duper high-tech auto-refinisher Dupont dewaxer/cleaner with a mild scrubby and screw up our new wax job, but.... it's easy to wax over the finished job.
He applied the port side first, doing his normal apply, smooth out any bubbles, burnish the backing paper to get his superior bond.
he proudly peeled off the backing paper -- and the vinyl literally peeled back off still attached. "Hmmmm... I must not have used enough dewaxer.." So he tried again with a new scrap piece of vinyl. Same deal. "Whatever wax did you use on this boat??"
The next day he called Collinite. The owner laughed and said, "You're not going to get it off with any dewaxer. You have to use mild compound on a 3M pad, then our fiberglass cleaner. And then do a test check before you apply it again."
So the next weekend, by hand, I removed all the Collinite we had just applied. Quite large areas, unfortunately.
kk
thank you everyone! i had taken an "old dog's" advice on the cleaner/waxer brand and now have like 4 bottles of it. guess i'll be using it up this year but using the 2 part next year!
Ken, how much of the cleaner and wax would i need, for my 34, do you think?
thanks
Quote from: anaisdog on April 21, 2017, 09:18:25 AM
thank you everyone! i had taken an "old dog's" advice on the cleaner/waxer brand and now have like 4 bottles of it. guess i'll be using it up this year but using the 2 part next year!
Do yourself a big favor and use it on something else -- !! or return/exchange it???!!
I had some leftover (still do.) -- I use it below on the liner -- clean non-stick surface helps prevent mold/mildew, or on other things I don't care that much about and are "clean" before waxing -- i.e., spars, any stainless, etc.
Stu -- what do you think 5 bottles each as a safe number. just for the topsidea? I think I use 3 each on the 30. CRS, though.
kk
i can't return it, it was from amazon. what did you use it on to use it up? the liner? like the ceiling?
On the liner ANYwhere NOT the sole. LOL
And other places I mentioned. Stainless. Power cord. Whatever else you may want to protect. On or off the boat.
If it was fulfilled by Amazon, you can return it.
Shipped direct from others, questionable.
k
amazon says "This item isn't eligible for return.
This item can't be returned since it requires special transportation and handling which we can't provide. Use the Contact us button for help addressing your issue. "
so i'm contacting them
Quote from: anaisdog on April 21, 2017, 10:46:55 AM
amazon says "This item isn't eligible for return.
This item can't be returned since it requires special transportation and handling which we can't provide. Use the Contact us button for help addressing your issue. "
so i'm contacting them
Sell it to the OLD SALT friend. LOL!!
i probably will!
BTW Becki- your hull is gelcoat not paint. Unless someone after the fact painted a new bootstripe.
then what would be blue coming off? though i was not the one buffing, i wasn't there. thanks
Quote
, i wasn't there. thanks
Sounds like an auto shop scam "hey lady look here .... while we were changing your tire your muffler fell off. It's right here -- we put a new one on for you". 😂
Seriously though, it's blue gel coat. Colored gel coat is "softer" because of the pigments, same as (think FORD) an auto with a dark paint job is more susceptible to oxidation and environmental pitting than a white vehicle.
Quote from: anaisdog on April 21, 2017, 01:00:24 PM
then what would be blue coming off? though i was not the one buffing, i wasn't there. thanks
I also have a painted blue stripe similar to yours
how do you buff it?
Quote from: anaisdog on April 21, 2017, 02:57:53 PM
how do you buff it?
becki. If it's painted you need to be much more careful than gel coat. As with any buffing you don't want to build up heat and soften the finish. Maybe that's what your "friend" was doing??
If you're talking buffing out a waxed finish it's less aggressive than compounding it. You want just enough to remove excess dried wax and polish it. Suggest you look around for auto refinishing tips. YouTube??
k
I'm not sure- autogeeks.com may have tips. They sell to that market and I have purchased from there.
I would caution using rubbing compound and power tools if you are inexperienced. Or at least practice on something that is not dear to you.
Have you read this from reply #2?
Here's the Holy Grail:
https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/tips-for-a-great-buff-wax.117266/ (https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/tips-for-a-great-buff-wax.117266/)
by Maine Sail
Becki, you don't need to mix compound with cleaner wax unless you want more grit. Cleaner wax IS wax + compound mixed.
Quote from: Stu Jackson on April 21, 2017, 08:03:32 PM
Have you read this from reply #2?
Here's the Holy Grail:
https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/tips-for-a-great-buff-wax.117266/ (https://forums.sailboatowners.com/index.php?threads/tips-for-a-great-buff-wax.117266/)
by Maine Sail
I'm in Mainesail's camp here.
Our 1987 boat had been treated with Poly Glow multiple times before we purchased her, and we had the yard clean and apply Poly Glow during the Survey / Purchase haul out.
Now our hull looks like Carp! We wash down the hull every trip and wipe off every couple of months. A marina boat crew 'cleaned' the hull (magic erasers) and ruined the Polyglow finish. So now it looks awful.
I followed Mainesail's process on our last boat, purchasing the products and equipment he recommended. The results on our last boat were spectacular! And it really was not such a big deal, although I'll make sure not to repeat it during the hot summer 8)
Planning on a haul (not quite as early as originally planned after our boat dive service reported that our bottom was looking really good) and at that time Iwe'll clean and polish the hull, it will look good. And best of all, our regular wipedowns should keep her looking good for a few seasons. (Sorry for those that have 'Seasons' they tend to be year round here in SoFla :D )
Paul
More support for the Mainesail approach from me. I followed the process on our previous boat - a 1978 CS27 with very good results. I don't recall if this is in the instructions be be careful if you are polishing near bootstripes or contrasting cove stripes. These are often painted on and you can get some colour transfer if you aren't careful about where you polish.
I haven't done in on our C34 since the flag blue Awlgrip paint still gives me a mirror finish with very little maintenance.
Dave- was your Awlgrip painted bootstipe OEM on your Mk 1.5, or done at a later date?
Hi Noah,
Our PO Awlgripped the whole hull and left a narrow white gelcoat bootstripe along the waterline. It looks great and except for a few spots with a bit of fender rash that i'm working on with Awl Polish, there is still a mirror finish.
Dave- great pics. Close reaching under spinnaker (while towing a dinghy!?)!! :clap I have a question about your hull portlights that I posed in a new thread.
I've done the Mainesail polish/wax treatment twice on my prior C250, and just a week ago on my C34mkII. It gets easier each time.
He does give some options on which materials to use, so I'll briefly describe what I use.
I really like using the Presta Ultra Cutting Cream for the polish. It starts as a course grit, but breaks down into a fine polish as you work it in with an electric buffer with wool pad. This gets you a nice shine in one step. The 32 oz bottle is costly at $30, but lasts a long time. I've done my C250 (twice) and 34mkII once, and still have a little left over. I also have the Collinite Liquid FG Cleaner that I use for hand-polishing intricate areas, but for a large smooth surface I prefer the Presta with electric buffer.
Make frequent use of a spray bottle with water to extend the open time of the Presta and provide cooling. If it dries out, you may damage the fiberglass due to excessive abrasion and/or overheating.
For the wax I have used Collinite 850 Fleet Wax. If you have done your polishing correctly, it should be wipe on/wipe off without any electric buffing required. If it's hard to get off, you're waiting too long, doing it in sunlight, and/or did not do a good enough job polishing. This year I used up the 850 and needed more on short notice (not enough time to order online or drive all the way to West Marine), and the guy at the nearby auto refinish store told me their 476s is the same stuff, just packaged and marketed for the automotive market. So I bought some and it seems to be the same as 850. Collinite's application tables suggest that it's the same stuff as well (same balance of properties). So if you want to support your local business, I'd suggest considering the 476s if your Presta dealer also carries Collinite. One advantage of buying locally is the ability to return unused material, which came in handy when I didn't end up needing that new bottle of Presta.
For my bootstrip restoration I have always started with a wet sand on the blue gelcoat bootstripe, followed by the Presta and wax. Don't overdo the sanding. You will see some light blue residue during the wet sanding. If your bootstripe is painted, all bets are off and you should be very careful. If the paint is Awlgrip or other 2-part urethane, I would only follow manufacturer's instructions for polishing.
I've used Poliglow on other boats, and have very mixed feelings about it. I'd always recommend the Mainesail procedure, and only resort to Poliglow if you find it impossible to get a truly glossy, non-porous finish by that method, or the hull form of the boat is too irregular to use a mechanical polisher. The former was the case with our Phantom sailing dinghy, and the latter was the case with our Trophy fishing boat. Polyglow worked well for those cases, but the Mainsail procedure gets superior results that last longer.
Quote from: anaisdog on April 21, 2017, 02:57:53 PM
how do you buff it?
Unfortunately, mine looks like it was painted on with a brush. I have waxed over it but will probably wait to polish it until I am ready to do something new.
Following up on my prior message, I just got home and got a chance to pull out some pics from my latest polishing job. You can get an idea of the appearance of the restored boot stripe, as well as the shine on the overall hull. Unfortunately, I was in too much of a hurry to get started, and neglected to take "before" pics. But the boot stripe was pretty severely chalked beforehand.