Catalina 34

General Activities => Main Message Board => Topic started by: csimmerling on June 16, 2022, 05:09:14 AM

Title: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: csimmerling on June 16, 2022, 05:09:14 AM
I have a small (7.5') inflatable that I was planning to store just ahead of the mast, covering the Vberth hatch. Any suggestions on best practices to tie it down? or will this always be a problem and I should store it elsewhere?
thanks!
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: tvorgitch on June 16, 2022, 08:44:40 AM
I had a slightly larger dinghy tied to my foredeck and when raising the mail, the dinghy cover got caught in the main halyard block and I could not raise or lower the main. I was able to use a spare block and a rolling hitch to take the tension off the line, but it was not a fun experience. I also found the dinghy would interfere with the headsail. I realized an inflatable is also deflectable so I just stored it in the v-berth. It should not take long to inflate a small dinghy and it sure is nice having it out of the way.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Jim Hardesty on June 16, 2022, 09:29:08 AM
I have an 8 foot Zodiac cadet with an air floor.   I've stored inflated in front of the mast, deflated in it's bag in front of the mast and towed.  I like towing, very little drag and it's always ready.  Only problem is with very tight docking.  Have a MKll and raise the bow of the inflatable on the swim step and can get into all but the tightest places.  My second choice is deflated in the bag in front of the mast.  Tie to the mast and forward shrouds.   
Leaving for Mackinaw next week and will probably tow.
Jim
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Noah on June 16, 2022, 10:04:56 AM
I have an old Avon Rover hypalon rollup aluminum slat floor 9' 2" that fits on my foredeck. I tie it around/under the teak handrails. One thing to consider is your comfort level with blocking the forward "escape/ventilation" hatch.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Ron Hill on June 16, 2022, 01:54:13 PM
csim : Have carried a 8' Rib on the fordeck for years!!  I tie a 7/16" Dacron braided line from a turnbuckle(center) under the teak hand hold thru an eye on the aft dink transom (thru twice) under the other teak hand hold to the center of the opposite turnbuckle. 

I'd strongly recommend a dink cover to keep it out of the HOT UV rays.  Also when anchored you can use an extra halyard attached to the dink bow so it can be raised allowing you to open the Vberth hatch.

A few thoughts
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Jim Hardesty on June 17, 2022, 04:36:30 AM
QuoteI tie a 1/2" Dacron braided line from a turnbuckle(center) under the teak hand hold thru an eye on the aft dink transom (thru twice) under the other teak hand hold to the center of the opposite turnbuckle.

I've seen shackles used to replace pins at turnbuckle/chainplate.  Then used for tying things.  Does look useful.  If I were to do that would get shackles with holes in pins to mouse it.
Just something I saw that stuck in the back of my mind.
Jim
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: scgunner on June 17, 2022, 08:15:29 AM
Over the years I've tried just about every way I could think of to store the dinghy and I finally settled on the foredeck upside down with a dinghy cover that matches the rest of the covers. It's a 10' RIB Caribe and I use a fender under the transom to keep it from banging against the deck I also clip the painter to the deck rail but other than that I don't use any type of tie downs.

To launch I just flip it over the side and to recover it I use the main halyard to bring it aboard both operations can be performed by one man. No problems when sailing although you do have to make sure the jib sheets don't catch under the dinghy but not a big deal. Also with the dinghy on deck I can still raise the forward hatch about 6" to 8" for ventilation.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Noah on June 17, 2022, 08:39:39 AM
Kevin— you use the main halyard not the spinnaker or jib halyard? The main halyard exists the mast aft and would have an odd lead around mast to pick-up a dinghy on and off the foredeck??? I use my spinnaker halyard and a West Marine lifting bridle. I also use my anchor windlass capstan to tail the halyard.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Jim Hardesty on June 17, 2022, 09:20:56 AM
QuoteI also use my anchor windlass capstan to tail the halyard.

Like that Idea :D    Will try it next time I get a chance.  Maybe some pipe insulation or pool noodles on transom to keep off deck.
Jim
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: scgunner on June 17, 2022, 10:09:39 AM
Noah,

I don't have a spinnaker halyard and I have a furling jib which puts the jib halyard at the sail top which makes its use for me impractical. The main halyard can be easily lead forward between the shrouds and the mast and attached to the dinghy painter then using the main winch haul the dinghy aboard.

While the bridle method looks like a good idea, for me since I'm usually alone when performing this operation I like to keep things simple by minimizing equipment and steps. From the time I lead the dinghy around to the side of the boat until it's secure on the deck is about five minutes.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Ron Hill on June 17, 2022, 01:32:25 PM
Guys : Like Noah I also use the spinnaker halyard.  I don't use the seat in the dink so my bridle always lies on the floor of the dink at the ready - not in the way at all!!  At Anchor (or on a mooring) I always lift the dink out of the water (to prevent slime and duck poop).  I found out over the years that slime will start to build on the third/fourth day in the water.  I have a flat fender that is tied to a stanchion base so the dink is not touching the boat's hull.  If it rains I take my "anchor washer" (which is a bulge pump that I let overboard)  and put it in the dink to pump it out.  I seldom leave the motor on the dink unless we are on a mooring (and  know we are going into town the next day, but I have lifted the dink up out of the water with the motor attached).

When lifting the dink I use the tow line to pull the dink forward so it is closer to the bow than mid-ships.  Also the tow line keeps the dink secure & from rocking back and forth.  Works great!!   :thumb:

A few thoughts
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Ron Hill on June 17, 2022, 01:49:45 PM
Kevin : Beside my spinnaker halyard, I took an old (usable) halyard and strung it thru the extra port side opening on the mast, up thru and over the extra (unused) port side forward sheave -  so I have a extra jib halyard that I use as a safety line when going to the top of the Mast.  You could do the same to lift your dink!! 

A thought
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Noah on June 17, 2022, 02:17:35 PM
Kevin-IMO, adding another Jib halyard forward is a much better solution than "forcing" your aft leading main halyard to guide/chafe across the masthead sheave and around the mast—to hoist in a direction it was not designed for.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Stu Jackson on June 17, 2022, 04:01:25 PM
Quote from: Noah on June 17, 2022, 02:17:35 PM
Kevin-IMO, adding another Jib halyard forward is a much better solution than "forcing" your aft leading main halyard to guide/chafe across the masthead sheave and around the mast—to hoist in a direction it was not designed for.

I agree.  My PO "left me with" a spare jib halyard, which I keep cleated on the mast and tied off on one of the port shrouds.  I also cleat off my normal jib halyard because with roller furling there is no need to run it back.  A jib halyard makes sense for dropping something on the foredeck.  IIRC, at one point in ancient history I was known to simply grab the dinghy painter and yank it over the lifelines.

We have a 10-2 air floor.  We've kept it inflated and inverted on deck as well as deflated and rolled up just forward of the mast.   There's plenty of room up there.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: dfloeter on June 18, 2022, 04:30:42 AM
We store a 9.5' AB aluminum dink on the fore deck with a cushion under the stern protecting the deck and the mast.   Using the spinnaker halyard to hoist I also hang a ratchet block from the pulpit and lead the painter through and back to pull the boat forward in front of the shrouds.  While my wife cranks on the mast winch I can ease it over the lifelines and down to the deck to flip over.   I can do it solo but prefer help.  The AB seems a lot heavier that advertised! Our old air floor 9' dink could be pulled up over the lifelines without a halyard.  I love the hard bottom but miss the portability of the roll up. 
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: scgunner on June 18, 2022, 10:54:16 AM
Noah,

Adding an unnecessary jib halyard to solve a problem that I already have a solution for seems a bit counterproductive. By walking the main halyard around the mast nothing is being "forced", due to the length of the halyard and the very slight angle of departure off the sheave the whole operation is really quite smooth. While this isn't an optimal angle, raising a dinghy puts only a very small fraction of the load that this rig was designed to handle. At this point I have yet to see any chaffing or any other damage due to this method and I've been doing it this way for about twenty years.

Stu,

There was also a time when I could just haul it over the lifelines and onto the deck but that was about three dinghies ago. This current Cribe weighs 95lbs and is a real mother to hump around without mechanical assistance.

Ron,

Fortunately for me duck poop isn't a problem in my neck of the woods.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Noah on June 18, 2022, 12:30:47 PM
Kevin- Apparently I don't understand the geometry and physics here; how you use a halyard that is fed aft over a sheave and drag it around the mast to pick up something on the beam, let alone forward of the mast, without it not coming off of the sheave channel and causing friction and chafe?? YBYC. BTW. An extra jib halyard is always a nice safety item to have run. Halyards do break.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Ron Hill on June 18, 2022, 01:04:51 PM
Kevin : You may not have duck poop, but after 3- 4 days I'm sure that slime and/or critters are trying to attach them selves to the bottom of any dink left in the water that long!!

I agree with Noah on the chafe but it's your Halyard!! 

A thought
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: scgunner on June 19, 2022, 09:43:38 AM
Noah,

I'm not a mathematician either nor do I play one on TV so the actual math eludes me. But I do know something of the mechanics involved based on experience. A roller sheave and line works best when pulling from dead center, however depending on the size of the sheave, line, application and installation there is an off center radius of operation of a certain number of degrees where the rig will still perform well. I don't know if my dinghy raising evolution is within that envelope but if not it's got to be pretty darn close and that's just based on actual experience.

FYI, a couple of years ago I replaced the main halyard for safety reasons since it's how I get up the mast. I examined the old one to see if there was any reason for concern other than peace of mind. Other than being faded I found no signs of chaffing or other damage of any kind. This is just my experience, I like to keep things as quick and simple as possible, as you say Your Boat, Your Choice.

BTW, in the thirty-four years I've owned my boat I've had two jib failures, both were the sail, not saying it doesn't happen but I've never had a busted halyard, jib or main.

Ron,

When my dinghy is in the water for a week or more I find 5min with a mask and a scratchpad once a week remedies that problem. It beats having to pull your dinghy out of the water every night.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Jim Hardesty on June 20, 2022, 05:50:40 AM
Loaded dinghy using the spin-halyard and windless.  Very little effort or time.   
Did a 10 foot loop at dinghy handholds away from side of boat, attached spin-halyard to that, loosened anchor rode about 20 feet, pulled dinghy up with windless, very little effort.  Used a couple of feet of 1/4 rope tied thru turn buckles and stanchion base made into loops, then a tie-down strap, also tied to mast. A piece of pool noodle and small fender at transom finished it.
https://www.harborfreight.com/set-of-2-1-inch-x-12-ft-lashing-straps-67386.html?_br_psugg_q=tie-down+straps
Jim



Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: LogoFreak on June 20, 2022, 02:10:36 PM
Maybe not ideal size wise, but a highfield 340 just fits. I will likely deflate it for longer passages but still keep it there.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Ron Hill on June 20, 2022, 02:40:00 PM
Kevin ; You missed the whole point!!  All you have to do is lift the dink out of the water and leave it overnight on the side of the boat.  Then there is NO need for any scrubbing!!  You only need to lift the dink for an overnight every 3rd/4th day the dink is in the water!!  Easily done in about 5 minutes!!

A thought
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Noah on June 20, 2022, 03:20:57 PM
Logo-The Highfields are very nice! Is it inconvenient to set your anchor with dinghy in that position? Do you need to move it to open chain locker?
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: LogoFreak on June 20, 2022, 04:25:05 PM
Noah, yes I can open the anchor locker. Obviously not as comfortable to get around the dinghy but doable, if I deflate the dinghy it's a non issue. The highfields are very nice indeed, love mine. One I went with is technically "too big" for a Catalina 34, however my brother and I go diving off the dinghy and leave the sailboat on anchor so I needed something larger to have room for two sets of gear and 3 people.

I also pull up the boat off the water a foot or two at night using the spare forward halyard, so the bottom doesn't get dirty, it really makes a difference.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: scgunner on June 20, 2022, 04:28:14 PM
Logo,

My Caribe is basically the same size and sits like yours. The weight of the dinghy keeps it in place even under sail and without tie downs. You can still raise the forward hatch to provide ventilation even underway and the dinghy acts like a dodger to keep down below dry. In answer to Noah's question it doesn't interfere with anchoring ops and actually provides a convenient seat while doing that.

Ron,

I may have missed the whole point but I only have to do my evolution once a week while you've got to do yours seven times a week to accomplish the same goal.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Jon W on June 25, 2022, 11:02:43 AM
Just got back from a short trip with roll up 9ft 2" Highfield with air floor tied to the foredeck for the first time. 2 straps from dinghy transom to center chainplates like Ron suggested, and 2 straps from dinghy towing D rings to pulpit, short pool noodles on the fwd end of the hand rails and on dinghy transom, and a 1 1/2" thick kneeling pad between deck and dinghy bow so the seat doesn't touch on the fwd hatch. Held fine in 16 knots, and some water over the bow. I use my whisker pole with a small triple block and tackle as a jib crane to raise and lower the dinghy off the foredeck into the water. Then I lead it to the back of the boat and store on my davits until I'm ready to leave, then put it back on the foredeck.
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: scgunner on June 26, 2022, 08:47:30 AM
Jon,

If you've got davits why do you store the dinghy on the deck?
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: waughoo on June 26, 2022, 11:09:53 AM
Davits for convenience and on deck for shorter slip fees and saver foul weather passages maybe?
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Noah on June 26, 2022, 12:07:35 PM
Alex—That's my take but lets see what Jon says. Also adds weight far aft and up and maybe lack of visibility aft?
Title: Re: new to inflatable dinghy - how to store in front of mast?
Post by: Jon W on June 26, 2022, 02:40:02 PM
Hi Kevin, Alex said it better than I. Currently I don't use the dinghy much when I'm in my slip. To avoid sun damage and added slip fees it's usually deflated, rolled up and stored below. While I'm underway I prefer it to be on the foredeck feeling it's more secure in case of rough weather or high following seas. When I'm at my destination, I store it on the davits which makes daily use easier, and deters theft (I hope).