What do you think of sailing a 1998 C34 MKII across the Atlantic from Cape Verde or Grand Canaries to the Florida Keys? It would happen in the last half of October/early November. Assume all relatively new safety equipment, daily wind frequent wind updates and route recommendations from Commanders, AIS, Radar, etc. I'm particularly interested in opinions about the strength of the boat to make such a journey. What Beaufort Force level was the C34 MKII designed to withstand? Your comments are welcome.
Bill, you might be interested in Steve's observations here:
https://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5270.0.html
Others have sailed from the Great Lakes through the Erie Canal and down to the Bahamas.
Those are the longest voyages I know of, other than my trip from SF to here in BC, but that was all motoring and harbor hopping up the coast. https://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,9157.0.html
Two C34 voyagers that come to mind and are worth a read:
One LA to Hawaii singlehanded
One NYC to Bermuda RT
I also heard one sailed to Australia? But maybe a rumor.
http://www.sailinghaunani.com/
http://www.wesail.com/fullmoon.html
Who sailed it to the islands off the coast of Africa?
I remember reading somewhere-can't remember now--that Catalina Yachts delivered some new C-34 boats to England/Europe by sailing them over there.
QuoteWhat do you think of sailing a 1998 C34 MKII across the Atlantic from Cape Verde or Grand Canaries to the Florida Keys?
Interesting. If I'm not mistaken that was the route of the Spanish Galleons. Arrrr. My questions are what are you doing for self steering and down wind sails? How many on your crew?
FWIW Was a sailor in Erie building a "boat" to do that same crossing. He was attempting the Guinness record for smallest vessel crossing Atlantic, wasn't much bigger than an oil drum. He did a couple of failed attempts that didn't last very long. Don't know where that project stands now.
Lots of luck and please keep us posted.
Jim
Wes : I'd definitely look at the weather history in that part of the Atlantic at that time of year!!
I could be wrong, but I seriously doubt that Catalina sailed their European deliveries across the Atlantic.
The only Catalina ocean going that I know of is the C27 that Catalina supported that sailed around the world!
A thought
I've read a lot about bluewater boats and sailing across oceans--I want to do it one of these years--and it seems to come down to risk management. I think the C34 would make it under most conditions but not sure about extremes.
Here are some thoughts on the Catalina 34: https://c34.org/faq-pages/faq-offshore.html
An interesting article on ARC failures: https://www.yachtingworld.com/sailing-across-atlantic/what-are-the-most-common-repairs-at-sea-for-yachts-sailing-across-the-atlantic-arc-survey-results-tell-all-109688
Check out the conditions this guy sails in:
https://www.youtube.com/c/ErikAanderaa. Do you accept the risk of being there in a Catalina 34, for days?
Christian Williams took an Ericson 32 to Hawaii and back solo. The Ericson 32 seems to have similar stability and other measures as the Catalina 34: https://youtu.be/28TAdDu5L6U
At least one owner mounted a Hydrovane on a Catalina 34mk 2: https://hydrovane.com/stories/catalina-34/catalina-34-extended-custom-a/
It seems like one 24-48 hour storm would put the same wear and tear on the boat as years of coastal sailing. I think about all the leaks, repairs and breakages I've had over the years happening during one crossing without outside assistance.
I've done several Chicago Mac races (333 miles non-stop) including 10'+ Lake Michigan waves (very steep)and one 70+ knot storm that disabled several boats. My Catalina 34 performed great, however the bad weather lasted hours, not days. This is roughly 10% of the ARC or Transpac.
Keep us posted on what you decide. Where is your boat now?
Quote from: Kyle Ewing on July 17, 2020, 08:11:49 PM>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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I think about all the leaks, repairs and breakages I've had over the years happening during one crossing without outside assistance.
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Take a look at our fixed portlights. Think about it. Weak link in the chain.
Plywood.
To quote someone: "There is no problem so great that it can't be solved."
8)
Wow. During hurricane season? Aside from the obvious dangers, would you even be able to get anyone to insure you?
I want to thank everyone for their comments. Very thoughtful and much appreciated. I will check out the links and give thought to the comments.
This C34 was built in 1998 (#1423), and delivered in Maryland. In 2008, a Swedish diplomat, working in WDC, bought it and eventually had it transported to Gothenburg Sweden. I think it's the only Catalina in Sweden. I want to get it back to Sarasota FL where I live, and I'm contemplating transport by cargo ship again or sailing across the Atlantic. Transport costs $15,000. I could add equipment for that money.
I've sailed it in the North Atlantic in 40 knot winds and 10 ft seas (not by choice) and it held up well. That's why I think it might make the crossing. The question is the seaworthiness. Here is a EU rating system that discusses the worthiness of boats in various conditions. How would you all rate aC34? I'm interested in having comments from others with more experience with C34s than me.
CE CLASS A yachts are designed for large sea voyages (everywhere), in which wind force may exceed 8 on the scale of BEAUFORT and waves can also exceed a significant height of 4 meters. These yachts are designed largely to be self-sufficient in this rather hostile environment. CAREFUL, in most cases, this is only theoretical.
CE CLASS B yachts are designed to travel off the coast (200 miles or less) in which the winds can be up to force 8 (not exceeding) and waves can reach a height up to 4 meters (not exceeding).
CE CLASS C boats are designed for travel close to the coasts and in large bays, estuaries, lakes and rivers in which winds can be up to force 6 (not exceeding) and waves may reach a height of 2 meters (not exceeding).
CE CLASS D boats are designed for cruises in protected waters, like small lakes, rivers and canals in which the winds can be up to force 4 and waves can reach a height up to 0.30 meter (less than 1 foot).
The rules of CE certification for construction and sale of boats are designed to assess the structural strength and integrity of essential parts of the hull, the reliability, and function of propulsion, steering systems, power generation and all other features installed on board to help ensure the key essential services of the yacht.
Thanks again for your comments.
Bill
I'm not a bluewater sailor and it doesn't sound like you are either, not to say you can't become one, but the first thing I'd do is establish your primary goal. What is it exactly you want to do, get this particular boat to Florida, make an Atlantic crossing, find the cheapest way to get the boat to Florida, it will help define your plan of action.
The first thing I'd do is talk to a lot of people and do a lot of homework. You may find that three months to get ready for this type of voyage just isn't going to be enough time, and even if you are ready in time, as Bob say you'll be sailing right into hurricane season.
You do have other options, for example I'd imagine you could hire an experienced bluewater crew to deliver the boat for a lot less than $15,000. Another option, if you like the C34 and want one in Florida why not just sell this boat and buy one in Florida?
I too do not understand the need to bring this boat over with the cost and risks involved. I guess if you want to do it because it is some kind of life event that you could do it as a great thing you did in your life. Maybe on your grave stone you could put " I sailed my Catalina 34 across the Atlantic during hurricane season and made it!".
Quote from: scgunner on July 19, 2020, 08:33:12 AM
I'm not a bluewater sailor and it doesn't sound like you are either, not to say you can't become one, but the first thing I'd do is establish your primary goal. What is it exactly you want to do, get this particular boat to Florida, make an Atlantic crossing, find the cheapest way to get the boat to Florida, it will help define your plan of action.
The first thing I'd do is talk to a lot of people and do a lot of homework. You may find that three months to get ready for this type of voyage just isn't going to be enough time, and even if you are ready in time, as Bob say you'll be sailing right into hurricane season.
You do have other options, for example I'd imagine you could hire an experienced bluewater crew to deliver the boat for a lot less than $15,000. Another option, if you like the C34 and want one in Florida why not just sell this boat and buy one in Florida?
Not condoning it, but I believe the best weather window/month to leave Europe and ride South Atlantic trades East to West to Caribbean and South America is November. Still may have some storm chances however.
Hello again:
Thanks again for the remarks. As a credentialed sea captain, I've done a lot of offshore sailing in the Atlantic, Caribbean, Mediterranean, North Sea, Baltic, Biscay Bay and other somewhat treacherous seas, including several MAC races in the late 70s which can be very treacherous indeed. The crew has also crossed the Atlantic before. The smallest boat was a Sweden Yachts 370. The largest is a Hylas 70 (a button boat that is not real sailing). I will have four experienced crew on board including me. I will not go this year. I'm preparing and sailing the boat this year in the Baltic Sea to get to know it a bit. It needs work too.
Noah, correctly emphasized that the weather conditions going from Europe to Florida are the best in early November due to easterly trades. I'll go down the west coast of Europe to around the 20th parallel then head across in early November just like almost everyone. The weather forecaster I've used, Commanders, has always provided exceptional guidance, and their services will be used again this time via ocens.com satellite communication.
This C34 was virtually given to me by the former owner and friend who was very ill and who has since died. He just wanted it off his mind and not to burden his family. I literally took it over and paid the costs to store it and launch it this summer. C34's are virtually unheard of in Sweden where most people are used to Hallberg Rassy, Najad, Malo. Arcrona and Swans. Moreover, 25% VAT and shipping costs make things extra expensive. I need a new main and genoa. They are the original sails from 1998. Yikes! Cost is about $7,000 here for both sails from North Sails or a local sailmaker using Dimension-Polyant fabric. So, the market value of this boat, assuming I could find and owner, is quite low here. In the US, it would be much higher, and I would like to have it Florida where I live in the winter months. I do not think it is worth transporting by cargo vessel.
My greatest concern is not the trip or the crew or weather, etc. I am concerned about the C34 itself. Does it have the integrity of hull, rigging and strength to deal with unexpected situations? There seems to be little or no information about this topic other than what I copied in my last post. This CE rating system is promoted by Beneteau over here. What design parameters were used with the C34: Force 10, 8, 6 or something else? How can I find out? This is my question. Would Catalina offer an answer? What do you think?
Thanks for your continued support.
It all depends on the conditions you experience. A well made deepwater boat can have major problems and a Columbia 26 can go around the world without seeing winds over 20 kts. An Islander 36 was beefed up and went around the world a few years ago with only a few problems.
The mast and rigging on a 34 are over sized and should not be a problem, as long as they are in good condition. The hull is well built and strong enough. My question would be if the connection of hull to deck joint and the bulkheads could take the beating. The cockpit on a Mk I is very large and the drains are far to small to drain it fast enough if you take a wave. Installing larger drains through the transom would help. The extreme forces on the rudder are always a potential problem, so the rudder and the steering system should be gone over very carefully. I would want a strong under deck auto pilot with a back up. As mentioned above, plywood window covers could protect the ports. I would rather take a 34 to Hawaii than cross the Atlantic, but it can be done.
I doubt you will get a meaningful commitment as to the structural rating/classification seaworthiness scale number, especially from Catalina Yachts—who are already on record as promoting the boat as a coastal cruiser. I agree with Gary that the boat is strongly built in most important places, but there are things to look for, inspect, upgrade. I would install a Hydrovane or some other wind vane system that could also serve as an emergency rudder. Add some solar power, and with a large crew, on a 3 week passage, you will need more water capacity. Maybe add strong double whisker pole set-up too.
Hi,
I know a couple who sailed their 89 Cat34 from montreal, quebec, canada all the way to the Martinique island.
They spent the first winter in the bahamas, and sailed slowly (like if you could go fast) down south after that.
And they made it back after 4 years of sailing.
But I know that it is not ocean crossing.
Hello all:
I want to thank you for your substantive remarks. They are all very helpful. I'm still not too sure about the integrity of the boat to make the crossing, and I doubt that I will ever get a definitive answer. Your remarks are very useful. So, its something of a risk. I know there are similar and smaller boats that have made it before. I have an estimate from a transporter who has quoted $15,500 for a "mast up" transport in October from Malmo Sweden to Port Everglades. All insurance included. Sounds tempting since I have a very small investment in this boat right now. Having the boat in Florida versus Sweden would be an advantage for rebuilding it. Still not too sure. My slip neighbor here in Sweden spent 12 years circling the globe in his Najad 42. He made every repair on his own except for a new teak deck. He encourages me everyday to make the crossing. I would not call him a risk taker.
Thanks again for your advice. It is greatly appreciated.
To quote the late Senator Lloyd Bentsen in his famous debate against Catalina 34, "I know Najad Yachts, and you sir are no Najad..." :abd: 8)
Bill : The C34 is built like a tank with most items oversized. However, the structure that I would be most concerned about is the spade rudder!!
My thought