I don't seem to be making as much power and getting a lot of black smoke at full throttle. Think I need to do a compression test. Should I remove the glow plug or injector for the gauge? Anybody know what size it is?
remove nozzles and check thread size at a store that sells only bolts and nuts.black smoke is not lack of compression,that should be blueish white smoke,pull oil fill cap and look for blow by.GOOD LUCK
lucky
hull 13
Ken, Went through the same process. In 2013 realized that I did not have as much power or speed, a lot more black smoke. In 2014 I noticed a significant about of loss and a lot of black smoke. This lead to a rebuild transmisson. I did have my compression checked.
Easy way to check if it is the transmission: secure it in the slip and start the engine and have someone put it in forward increasing the throttle as you watch to see if the shaft turns faster. (probably not very scientific)
Paul
Ken : Black smoke usually means the engine is being overloaded for the amount of fuel. Overload (dirty bottom/prop) Insufficient air (restriction), Excessive fuel (defective injector/s)
Hope this helps!!
Ken, let us know what you find.
Thanks,
Paul
Another way of compression test is to use a temp sensor gun when the engine has been running for awhile shoot all the cylinder heads they should be the same temp. Not as good as a compression test but a good start. A lot of the engine survey are done this way now. Charlie
I don't normally clean the engine air filter until the foam filter on the outside needs to be changed. Thinking about what Ron and Lucky said, I decided to pull the unit and check it. Surprise! The stainless steel wool inside is beginning to flake and the screen in the bottom was almost completely blocked. Another chore to add to the spring recommission checklist! Started the engine, at the dock in gear can get 2700 rpms at full throttle, normal underway is 2900 so I think the problem is solved. Used the temp gun to check all the cylinders, they were within 3 degrees of each other so I think other than having 2200 hours on it all is fine.
The stainless mesh can be replaced with roller store stainless steel pot "scrubbies"
kk
Thanks Ken, I was going to look at Ace but the roller (Dollar?) store is closer.
Darn Siri is just not cooperative at all'
NAPA has small engine foam filters that fit, though I don't know the p/n.
kk
Quote from: KWKloeber on May 23, 2017, 05:31:41 AM
NAPA has small engine foam filters that fit, though I don't know the p/n.
http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,7370.msg50214.html#msg50214
Stu
Interesting, but I'm a little confused by your prior post. Could you clarify because I suspect this will pertain to my engine also?
You say you had the old, round style, no air horn? That originally came with A foam a pre-filter.
You said you replaced it with another? Round?. Are you saying a whole new housing?
Or just a filter that fits inside the round coffee can? Or simply replace the foam outside?
Thanks
Ken
Quote
Our 1986 M25 came with the "old style" round filter, no snoot. We replaced it with the new style with the foam filter. That filter can be replaced at Napa auto with a Briggs & Stratton filter piece. Napa 7-02278 Pre-filter, replaces B&S 270782, 271794 pre-filter for 7-02210
« Last Edit: June 30, 2015, 01:05:14 PM by Stu Jackson »
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Stu Jackson, C34 IA Secretary, #224 1986, "Aquavite" Cowichan Bay, BC Maple Bay Marina SR/FK, M25, Rocna 10 (22#) (NZ model)
CD sells both the full can kit and the foam sleeve, if you want to go that route.
Quote from: KWKloeber on May 23, 2017, 09:45:23 AM
You said you replaced it with another? Round?. Are you saying a whole new housing?
Or just a filter that fits inside the round coffee can? Or simply replace the foam outside?
Old style vs. new style was inscribed in the parts manual from our local Universal dealer when I bought the new filter in 1999. My filter is horizontal on our M25.
Very interesting Stu. Do you happen to have a photo of that?
http://www.catalinadirect.com/index.cfm/product/3070/air-filter-waluminum-honeycomb-universal-diesel.cfm
This is what I have, I didn't get it from CD but from the local Universal dealer, many, many years ago.
Stu,
OK, I think we are zeroing in here. So you basically, replaced the old round coffee can filter that used mesh and a foam pre-filter, with a new round coffee can filter that uses mash and a foam pre-filter?
Simply because you wanted a new one?, Or because you wanted the aluminum rather than steel? Or because you didn't know where to get the mesh and foam separately?
I've been looking for a filter element that fits inside the coffee can to do away with the mash I've come close but not quite the right dimension.
I was confused because I would consider that a vertical filter because it sits on a vertical throat. The filter on the XPB I would call the horizontal filter because it sits on a horizontal throat. toMATo or toMAto. I don't know if there's a "standard" nomenclature.
kk
Potato!!! :shock:
My old filter was just a can, no foam. Horizontal because it sits flat on the hole which is vertical; we differ on definitions.
I don't have a digital picture of the old one because I replaced it before they invented digital cameras. :D
I don't have a digital picture of my newer one installed on the boat that I could easily find, so I posted the link which shows what I do have.
This link to TOAD shows BOTH, although I don't recall the side opening on my old one, but then, to beat a dead horse, it was so long ago.
http://www.marinedieseldirect.com/catalogs/catalog_group.php?owner=mdd&page_ident=200142-15&model=M-25 / M-25XP / M-25XPA&manufacturer=Universal&title=Inlet Manifold Group and Exhaust Manifold&quant_position=&catalog=200142&printparts=200142&printservice=200151&printoperators=200157&comment1=Part reference number 8 can be replaced with part reference number 17. This is reported to provide some noise reduction.
Sorry, TOAD's URL link doesn't work. Go to the M25 Inlet Manifold Group to see.
Some say potatoE. Then they go away and are forever forgotten.
Stu,
Is below your OEM? Well not "Stu Jackson's," because it was another Catalina owner's (and is now mine) and was from a newer engine than Stu's.
But (with the internal screen and squiggleies removed) it had a perforated, rather than honeycomb shell? That's how my 1984 M25 OEM filter is -- (a denser) foam was OEM but probably long missing from your '86 as it eventually was on my '84.
(http://c34.org/wiki/images/thumb/b/b5/File_001.jpeg/600px-File_001.jpeg)
(http://c34.org/wiki/images/thumb/1/1e/File_000.jpeg/800px-File_000.jpeg)
A little Tuesday evening engine trivia/and warning for anyone with the above type coffee can:
There's two styles/constructions. Above has a clearly recognized, 1-piece stamped bottom and throat.
The other construction was a clearly recognized, 2-piece bottom and throat (below.) You can see the ridge outside and inside, the peined-over tabs holding the two parts together.
(http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/attachment.php?attachmentid=9260&d=1311903044)
(http://www.ericsonyachts.org/infoexchange/attachment.php?attachmentid=9261&d=1311903047)
If any owners have the 2-piece, inspect the guts. Make sure the tabs are tight and secure -- they loosen with engine vibration and the two parts rattle loose and can become dangerous (stressed tabs can break off and enter the throat.)
Pien-over the tabs to make them tight and/or replace it if it's too badly worn.
Ken
I hate cleaning foam filters. When mine get dirty just make a new one. cut a new piece of foam with an overlap and hot glue gun together. Or if you but joint I always add a couple of whipping twine stitches to help hold it together. I had always thought the inside was steel mesh as a fire arrester as well as a filter.
Ken,
No flame arrester is necessary on a diesel-it's nonexplosive and no fuel air vapor as with a carbureted engine
Another option I've seen people do, is wrap and overlap foam, and hold it in place with two zip ties. Easy Peazy.
kk
Quote from: Ken Juul on May 24, 2017, 06:29:16 AM
I hate cleaning foam filters. When mine get dirty just make a new one. cut a new piece of foam with an overlap and hot glue gun together. Or if you but joint I always add a couple of whipping twine stitches to help hold it together. I had always thought the inside was steel mesh as a fire arrester as well as a filter.
Was the new foam the same density? If to dense, you may end up with black smoke.
Quote
Was the new foam the same density? If to dense, you may end up with black smoke.
FYI the OEM silencer was what you would typically think as "foam rubber", thinner than the wide open, black "expanded" wrap I pictured below earlier (I wouldn't really call it "foam" pe se.) Neither are a filter, but a silencer on the air intake.
Since we have wandered into the field of filters. Does anyone ever clean the filter in the blow back system? My filter is inside the valve cover.
Paul
Quote from: Paulus on May 25, 2017, 05:31:48 AM
Since we have wandered into the field of filters. Does anyone ever clean the filter in the blow back system? My filter is inside the valve cover.
Paul
Presumably your breather hose is led to the air intake?
I have often thought about just removing the filter since everything is getting sucked back in anyway.
I replaced mine with a K&N and did away with all of this.
Answers to Ken's earlier questions:
Thank you Stu,
An M 25 with the fuel bleed knob -- presume that you replaced the bleed screw with the knob?
kk
Quote from: KWKloeber on June 20, 2017, 05:29:32 PM
Thank you Stu,
An M 25 with the fuel bleed knob -- presume that you replaced the bleed screw with the knob?
My wonderful little putt-putt came that way (unless the PO did it, but I doubt it). That's how I knew when I read the original 1987
Mainsheet articles what they meant by "knurled knob." I was an engineer, so I knew what knurled was, the knob was harder to figure out. :D
Learn something new every day.
I thought the change was made only on the XP.
It must be late model M 25s already made the switch to the knob. Hard to tell by the photo, but it looks like it's just a port (Just like the screw bleed), not daisychained to the banjos.