Ok, so on the new LCD Hour Meter/Tach combos, the HM is advanced via the tach signal, not just by being powered by 12v (this results in true "engine run" hours, instead of "tach powered-up" hours.)
So there's no way to advance a replacement tach to match the engine hours. :cry4` or is there? ....maybe...... :donno:
Would, seeing that the alternator sends a 12v A/C signal, would hooking the tach to a step-down 120 vac to 12 vac wall-plug-in transformer advance the hour meter? The current in the tach signal wire is low, and I see 12 vac wall-plug transformers that can supply up to 5 amps AC.
Does anyone have any knowledge (that would make you an aficionado) or experience with this?
How's that for an oddball? :?:
Ken
Just testing the new image uploader... :donno:
Faraday cage or not, that's just plain wrong! :shock: :shock: :shock:
Quote from: KWKloeber on April 07, 2017, 06:01:16 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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So there's no way to advance a replacement tach to match the engine hours. :cry4` or is there? ....maybe...... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Couldn't one just hook up the HM to any 12V source and leave it on as long as you like or is necessary? 2,000 hours is about 3 months, though!
All the Seaward cockpit panel manuals show the hook up of the combined tach hour meter. As far as I know, they are separate signals, and the HM runs whenever there is power applied, regardless of whether the engine is actually running or not.
What I don't know is how one would try to save time by making it go faster than hour-for-hour. Kinda like those old cassette tape dual decks that you could run at double speed to record dups twice as fast.
I love you Stu, but I think you didn't read my post. Or at least all of it before jumping in. Or on? ;-)
I clearly stated that, the LCD digital hour meter/ Tachs DO NOT Advance by merely applying 12 volts. The hourmeter advances only when it receives the alternator tach signal. I also stated that, this is because they are set up to accurately measure engine running time, not merely 12 volt energized time.
The desire is to advance the hourmeter, not run anything faster than it normally would be. The thought/questionwas, since the alternator signal is 12 V AC, why would a 12 V AC transformer work?
Capisce?
k
Ken, I just edited my post before i read yours. Perhaps you could try again.
Alternatively buy the less expensive tach without an hour meter, and install a Hobbs meter near or in the engine room. I can't even begin to count the number of tachometers I have replaced because "my hour meter quit but the tach is fine". Oh and just be glad you can drop in a $60.00 tach vs. a $650.00 Yanmar/VDO that is a proprietary fit/design...
Quote from: Stu Jackson on April 08, 2017, 03:19:36 AM
Ken, I just edited my post before i read yours. Perhaps you could try again.
Stu,
Non comprendo, Senor.
I see your post, but "try again???" I'll restate it differently (4 ways below)
Quote
Couldn't one just hook up the HM to any 12V source and leave it on as long as you like or is necessary?
1). NO! One cannot do that. Well one could, but the hour meter will NOT advance. Nada. Zip. Niet.
2). They don't work the same as the mechanical HMs.
3). They advance ONLY when receiving the alt signal.
4). New tach, different technology.
More clearly stated now? (Below I explained (one reason) WHY they have them operate that way)
k
Quote from: KWKloeber on April 07, 2017, 06:01:16 PM
Ok, so on the new LCD Hour Meter/Tach combos, the HM is advanced via the tach signal, not just by being powered by 12v (this results in true "engine run" hours, instead of "tach powered-up" hours.)
My apologies. I was wrong. Sorry.
Aaaaha. I see now. It's all good.
should have emphasized "LCD"
k
Does it require an AC signal, or just a Hi Lo varying signal?
Makes think of another use of the old Bell Buzzer!
If it's just an intermittent signal, then the buzzer should do it.
Or MacGyver it - Attach an motor turned in a drill chuck (assuming the drill isn't destroyed while trying out the engine start sequence :santa)
Paul
Paul,
In a word, :donno:
It may be simply a 0v /+12v pulse, not -12v /+12v. My background is CE, not EE! Electronics baffle me.
I's hate to ruin a new $90 tach trying it out w/a 12vac transformer and ruin my day. Surely there must be some sparks person in he group that knows?!? :D
BTW, speaking of engine start sequence. Peggy does know that you don't have an A-4 ignition that could be cobbed into a makeshift AED, right? Better have one on standby when you do this.
ken
Quote from: mainesail on April 08, 2017, 04:44:56 AM
Alternatively buy the less expensive tach without an hour meter, and install a Hobbs meter near or in the engine room. I can't even begin to count the number of tachometers I have replaced because "my hour meter quit but the tach is fine". Oh and just be glad you can drop in a $60.00 tach vs. a $650.00 Yanmar/VDO that is a proprietary fit/design...
Any recommendation on a Hobbs meter? I am facing exactly the "$650.00 Yanmar/VDO" problem on a friend's Jeanneau, where the hour meter portion died (sorry - that's not a C34 issue, but the overall topic is relevant). I may tear it apart to fix, but figured a Hobbs meter is a good solution. I'd like one that's surface mount in the engine compartment and am having trouble finding that mounting configuration. The same situation presumably applies to C34s.
ALSO - I see several battery operated ones on Amazon that claim to not need wiring, but instead rely on sensing the engine vibration. Reviews are mixed and I worry that they are unreliable. Anybody have experience with them?
Jeremy
Quote from: mainesail on April 08, 2017, 04:44:56 AM
Alternatively buy the less expensive tach without an hour meter, and install a Hobbs meter near or in the engine room. I can't even begin to count the number of tachometers I have replaced because "my hour meter quit but the tach is fine". Oh and just be glad you can drop in a $60.00 tach vs. a $650.00 Yanmar/VDO that is a proprietary fit/design...
Thanks Rod, and good idea -- had already been discussed.
It's kinda like AIO printers -- why throw away three things when one craps out. Although thet'e so cheap now you an afford to.
The fuel gauge is already being moved to one "like yours" to make way for an oil pressure. Build the boats/panels cheap, cheap, cheap with no oil pressure gauge. Makes no sense.
Thanks,
Ken
Still begs the question, though --- will any AC source work? So I just put the question to VDO, V-3, and Faria. We'll see...
Our Tach Engine Hours meter stopped long before we purchased Eximius.
During the Engine Harness replacement, I also installed all new instruments but didn't want to spring for the Tach that included the hour meter.
So I installed a $13 hour meter
Docooler® Tachometer Tach Hour Meter for car
by Docooler
Link: http://a.co/1Hzn1OZ (http://a.co/1Hzn1OZ)
It's installed at the Nav Station.
Paul
Quote from: J_Sail on April 08, 2017, 11:43:49 AM
1. (sorry - that's not a C34 issue, but the overall topic is relevant). I may tear it apart to fix, but figured a Hobbs meter is a good solution.
2. I'd like one that's surface mount in the engine compartment and am having trouble finding that mounting configuration. The same situation presumably applies to C34s.
1. I've read about a detailed repair on www.sailboatowners.com. The writer was eloquent and did a well documented presentation. Months later he came back and said "Don't bother."
2. The engine compartment seems to be a counter-intuitive place for it. Wouldn't an easy place to see it be more appropriate?
Quote from: Stu Jackson on April 08, 2017, 04:28:42 PM
2. The engine compartment seems to be a counter-intuitive place for it. Wouldn't an easy place to see it be more appropriate?
Not necessarily. How often do we "need" to know the engine hours? For me, the times were when the engine cover is off anyway -- to change oil, perform maintenance, replacing a gizmo. If there was room on a panel, sure, otherwise the engine compartment is fine/dandy. It's not like something like a waste tank level where one would want to have visible gauge to monitor the status.
k
Quote from: KWKloeber on April 08, 2017, 04:50:28 PM
Quote from: Stu Jackson on April 08, 2017, 04:28:42 PM
2. The engine compartment seems to be a counter-intuitive place for it. Wouldn't an easy place to see it be more appropriate?
Not necessarily. How often do we "need" to know the engine hours?
I do, regularly. I decided a loong time ago, even before you showed up here, that I wouldn't bother with a fuel gauge and would keep track of my engine hours to use as a fuel gauge. It has served me very well, far superior to those questionable and non-linear gauges.
On our trip north from SF last summer, one harbor reputed to have fuel simply didn't! I was easily able to calculate how far we could go and compare it to the distance to the next harbor with fuel.
It is also a good yardstick to assure that engine operation is within historical norms.
Your boat, your choice. :)
Quote from: Stu Jackson on April 08, 2017, 05:46:39 PM
Quote from: KWKloeber on April 08, 2017, 04:50:28 PM
Quote from: Stu Jackson on April 08, 2017, 04:28:42 PM
2. The engine compartment seems to be a counter-intuitive place for it. Wouldn't an easy place to see it be more appropriate?
Not necessarily. How often do we "need" to know the engine hours?
I do, regularly. I decided a loong time ago, even before you showed up here, that I wouldn't bother with a fuel gauge and would keep track of my engine hours to use as a fuel gauge. It has served me very well, far superior to those questionable and non-linear gauges.
On our trip north from SF last summer, one harbor reputed to have fuel simply didn't! I was easily able to calculate how far we could go and compare it to the distance to the next harbor with fuel.
It is also a good yardstick to assure that engine operation is within historical norms.
Your boat, your choice. :)
Sure that makes a lot of sense, but then keep the Hm at the cockpit, in favor putting the fuel gauge below!!!
A wristwatch also works while motoring.
k
Quote from: KWKloeber on April 08, 2017, 05:50:20 PM
A wristwatch also works while motoring.
Yeah, but the sundial is a bear to keep calibrated... :clap :clap :clap
Quote from: KWKloeber on April 07, 2017, 06:01:16 PM
Ok, so on the new LCD Hour Meter/Tach combos, the HM is advanced via the tach signal, not just by being powered by 12v (this results in true "engine run" hours, instead of "tach powered-up" hours.)
An
UPDATE on advancing the LCD hour meter on the new tachs....
YES, a simple AC to AC wall transformer
WILL advance the HM (I copied the info from Faria below.)
BUT.... has anyone replaced a Teleflex tach w/ a Faria 4000 rpm tach and knows the correct alt/tach ratio setting (on an M-25 or XP, with the old standby 51a/55a motorola alternator.) Or at least a starting point?
thx Ken
From: Jason Clark
Sent: Mon Apr 10, 2017 9:28 AM
To: Faria Beede Instruments, Inc.
Hello,
Set the tach on setting one.
50 - 60 Hz will read about 1000 RPM's . That's enough to get the hour meter to start counting.
Supply 12 volts power to the tach. Then apply the AC signal between ground and signal terminal on the tach.
Once the needle reads over 400 rpm or so the meter will start to count.
Min signal voltage is 2.0 VAC to 35 VAC max. The current is typically milliamps so I don't think signal draw will be an issue.