Lifeline Netting around boat?

[pkhedlin]

I am sure we can call them back, but the people we bought our boat from told us that they had a net around their boat for a couple of years when the grandkids were younger.  . .we are interested in doing this for added safety of our own children. They DEFINITELY never step foot on the docks without a life jacket, let alone roam around deck without one ... BUT we would still like to consider trying to prevent any accidents.

Has anyone here done this or do you just rely on the life jackets and whatever is already around the boat?

[Stu Jackson]

When our kids were younger, on our C22 and C25, we considered it, but chose to teach them how to get around safely on the boat.  Same thing when we bought a house with a pool.  We taught them to swim.  The dependence on the connection of the bottom of the netting to the deck to ensure safety is questionable at best.  A tether and some instruction could go a much longer way to safety.  One man's opinion.

I don't recall this question being asked before, but try a search on "lifeline netting", either word or both.

[markr]

I have two young kids - a 19 month old boy who is everywhere and a 7 month old girl. The baby mainly stays below and I have a lifejacket for her when she is held in the cockpit. I use a tether attached to a harness and/or lifejacket when the boy is in the cockpit. I attach it to the pedestal. I do not allow him out of the cockpit and if he could get over the side, he would! I have been researching lifeline netting and prices etc. We also have a dog that sometimes comes out with us. I think it is a good idea. It would, of course, not be foolproof - but I think that as a preventative measure, along with all the other things such as tethers and lifejackets, it would help (and with the dog).
Stu has a great point - the attachment at the bottom, which I assume is only where the netting contacts the stanchions, and it will only be as good as much as the whole thing is under tension.....If we were at, for example, anchor, and he had a lifejacket on, was being constantly watched, and we had netting, I would relax and let him get about on deck a bit.
Related to my ongoing quest for bluewater capability information on the 34, I was in a bookstore recently looking at second hand cruising books and there was (I forget the name) a wonderful looking book with a photo on the front from the 70's of a world cruising family - looking down from the mast onto the foredeck there was the husband doing something and next to him on the foredeck were two naked babies crawling around! I could see netting on the lifelines and also around the pulpit area.

[chedlin]

Well, we have a 5 year old that is working very well for, but the youngest won't be 2 until May.  I guess it would have helped if my wife had mentioned the ages of our children.

The tether seems like a reasonable idea that we had considered, but it isn't my first choice.  I am worried about strangulation (Why I don't worry about it with all the other lines is beyond me, but it doesn't seem too difficult to control the sheets).  A tether line is going to be moving around a lot!

[Joe and Carol]

We installed the net for our dogs!  Whose picture you can see in the Fleet Four news of the coming June MainSheet issue. ( Spencer is the dark poodle and Sunny is the light poodle. ) Who seem to want to take their watch from all points on deck!  I like the net.  If you install one fix it so you you can tighten up points of sag and adjust the net easily.  Our job took quite some time to make it look fine around the bow spirit.  We did not take the net totally around the cockpit and stern.  Only brought it down the non boarding side of the boat stopping at the stern. If I did the job again, I would use a pilot line to affix the net bottom side to the lifelines / stanchions concentrating the botton of the net stretched tightly and having the top of the net laced short of the top lifeline.  You'll see what I mean if you this project DIY.  The net has weathered well cause we don't take it off in the winter.  Best of Luck!

P.S.  In the next MainSheet, all the dog members of Fleet Four are pictured with their crew!

[Ron Hill]

pkh : The rule that we have always had with our grandchildren is:
1. If you stay in the cockpit or below no life jacket
2. If you move out of the cockpit life jack MUST be worn

We found that in the summer let the kids pick the type jacket they WANT to wear.  The type II are cooler, but a type III that has "Barbie" printed on it works - even though Grandpa thinks it's hotter!!!

A few thoughts - let them pick !!!

[waterdog]

Our rule has always been if you are outside, you wear a life jacket if you are a kid.  At night, everybody gets a life jacket and a tether.   

We don't like netting because Scupper get's caught up in it when he wears a harness or his lifejacket.   He's has fallen overboard and as a black dog he is really difficult to see.  We make him wear a yellow life jacket in seas and add a red flashing LED at night to aid in recovery.   

In our cockpit we have weather cloths, and we love these.    They keep lines, kids, dogs, boogie boards, shoes, oars, mahi mahi, tuna, and all manner of things from falling overboard.   Upper lifeline passes through a sleeve.    The bottom of the weather cloth is fastened with twist lock fasterners every foot or so on the outside of the toe rail.   

[Michael Shaner]

Great topic...one very close to heart...

We have a 4 year old boy that always wants to go forward while underway. He sinks like a stone. Our solution is a spare halyard and a full harness for the little man. I think I first read about it here. Buy one that will fit over the kid's PFD. We clip him in with the halyard taught just forward of the cockpit coaming and let him go from there. Follow them if you're not comfortable with the situation. Have someone in the cockpit take up slack if necessary. Suddenly you've got a "free range" kid who couldn't touch the water if they tried...

There should be multiple points in the cockpit to tether the harness (I mean kid) to if the weather catches you while you're out. Keep the tether short enough that the harness contents (I mean kid) can't leave the cockpit.  

I believe PFD's are legally required in Virginia for those above decks under the age of 12. That's our boat rule anyway...

Again, Ron is spot on...let the child pick the PFD and they will wear it...with less of a battle...

 

[Bob K]

We used the netting on our C27 with both of our kids, from infants through approx 6 years of age.  Had a taut line running through the lower portion of the netting from stanchion to stanchion, acting as a 3rd, deck level lifeline, so there was little chance of going under the lines.  The netting came with the boat, so there wasn't any thought about getting it or not.  We thought it worked great, especially because they always wanted to go up front.   We also had lifejacket rules for all times out of cabin.  We used a tether on our first (son), and that worked out, but I don't think we used it after the first year due to tangling (and whining).  The best thing we did was bring a car seat along and lash it to the settee to provide a secure place for sleeping or just stayimg put.     I also recall cutting away the netting from around the cockpit area as the kids got older - at that point we felt it was no longer needed there.  So I'm in the thumbs up camp for netting - it does a good job keeping them where they belong!

[pablosgirl]

we raised 4 children while going sailing. When we bought our first boat (86' Hunter 23) when our first son was 3 months old.  He started out strapped in his car seat bellow or in the bottom of the cockpit with an life jacket attached to the car seat.  When he was 6 month old we found a vest life jacket that fit him and had a broad collar that would hold his head out of the water that had a webbing loop attached to it.  When he started walking, we added a safety harness and tether.  He was a very easy going child and would be content to lay in his car seat and nap to the motion of the boat. When he out grew the car seat, we would bring along a folding portable crib that just fit between the settee seats down bellow for him to take his nap in and to sleep in at night.  Two years latter, when our second son was born, we moved up to an 88' Hunter 26.5.  This doubled the volume of the down bellow space.  we followed the same procedure with him and our two girls as with the first.  After our fourth was born, we were quite a site to be seen on the water, with one in a car seat, two tethered to the cockpit and the oldest roaming the deck in his life jacket.  I had thought many times about installing netting on the life lines but never got to that project.  We seemed to manage well without it,  But I am sure that it would have given us better piece of mind.  In the end, not having the netting made us much more attentive of what each of the kids was up to at all times.  I whole hardily agree with Ron about letting the kids pick out there own life jackets.  We did this with each of ours and it worked well.  Plus we ended up with extra life jackets for their friends as they out grew them.

The boat had a wonderful walk through transom with the center part of the stern pulpit folding down into the water as a swim ladder.  My wife and I have many fond memories of towing the older kids in our inflatable dingy behind the boat when the wind was light (life jackets and tethered to the dingy of course).  My fondest picture of the kids was taken on a father's day with the kids all lined up on there stomach's across the cabin top just forward of the companion way hatch, side by side looking aft with ear-to-ear grins, wearing their life jackets!  We owned that boat 22 years and just last year bought our C34.

Our current starboard slip neighbor has installed netting for his 5 year old daughter on his 39' Pearson   He said that it took way longer than he expected to do.  The hardest part he said was to stretch the 1/4" strand-x line between the lifeline bases to hold the bottom of the netting taught.  He ended up installing an eye strap to the toe rail at the mid point between each of the lifeline stanchions to make the netting effective.

Paul & Cyndi Shields

[markr]

Well, we have a 5 year old that is working very well for, but the youngest won't be 2 until May.  I guess it would have helped if my wife had mentioned the ages of our children.

The tether seems like a reasonable idea that we had considered, but it isn't my first choice.  I am worried about strangulation (Why I don't worry about it with all the other lines is beyond me, but it doesn't seem too difficult to control the sheets).  A tether line is going to be moving around a lot!

For both adult crew and kids, I am of the school of thought that I would rather keep them from going overboard/keep them attached to the boat than have to practise MOB for real. Given that, I like to use the automatically inflatable lifejackets with integral harness, plus a tether, to keep people at least attached to the boat. I have purchased two jacklines (i.e. flat webbing that runs fore & aft from the bow to the stern on each side deck, flat to the deck) that can be fitted and allows anyone going out of the cockpit to attach their tether to.
For my 1 year old boy, I have a range of baby lifejackets but I also found an infant sized harness with tether in a chandlery. The harness can be worn in the cockpit without a lifejacket and is more platable to him than the lifejacket. The lifejacket can be put on over the top or alternatively the tether can be attached directly to the lifejacket. I find that if I attach the tether to the pedestal it also prevents him diving down the companionway - he did fall once while at our slip and I was below and caught him, but not before he bruised his lip on the steps. Scary moment!
I guess there may be a risk of strangulation, the theory being that he will be watched while in the cockpit. I think the netting would be a good idea and I like the idea of an additonal tight line a toerail level as descibed in an earlier post. At a boat show, my son (18 months) was next to me on the dock and he sat down next to a banner that was stretched across the edge of the dock. He thought it was solid and slipped through backwards, ending up upside down in the water. I was there in a microsecond to grab his leg and haul him out, but seeing him in there upside down in the water was absolutely terrifying. He came out screaming and I nearly had a heart attack!
Having seen that image, I am not taking ANY chances of him going overboard - so I wpould prefer him attached to the boat and at least with a lifejackert on if he is not wearing the harness. If we are around and about on the docks, he is now be wearing a lifejacket to run around in.....
In California, if kids less than age 12 are not down below, they have to legally either wear a lifejacket or alternatively be tethered to the vessel.....

[Steve Sayian]

I'm in the same camp as Stu.

We raised two kids on sailboats and never used/had netting.  Teach them the correct way to navigate the weather decks with proper life jackets and you'll rest easier and their confidence will soar.

[Mert Gollaher]

We also have never had netting.  We have a rule that everyone 12 and under wear life jackets on the docks, on deck, and in the cockpit.  (Our club and Connecticut also have similar requirements.)  The jackets can come off when feet hit the cabon sole.  We've focused on teaching the right way to move around on deck, and either Nicole or I followed them around alot as they learned.  We do supplement with tethers and cockpit confinement when things get a little rough.  Our kids are now 8 and 6, and it's great to see them doing things right.  I strongly endorse letting the kids pick the vest as well.  Scooby Doo and Dora the Explorer were great finds.

By the way, a friend does use netting on his J92.  He installed it when his kids were very small, and has since kept it forward of the stays to give the foredeck guy an easier time controlling sails when we race shorthanded.  Having done the foredeck on a cold, wet day during Off Soundings, I can say that it helps.

[Kyle Ewing]

I have two and four year old boys, each of which have been on the boat with us since they were a few months old.  We dismissed lifeline netting as a false sense of security (it seems there'll be a hole somewhere that won't be sealed) and maintenance-spiders, cleaning, UV damage, etc.

We tether as much as possible and assign an adult to each kid.  We strictly enforce lifejackets on the dock and above deck.  Lifejackets stay in the car for the wall to and from the boat.

The only kid overboard event we've had is when our two year-old fell in (twice) while trying to climb a dockline to board a boat.

an equal concern to falling overboard is falling down the companionway steps.  Some days they're more interested in going up and down while underway. 

[Bobg]

The boat next to me has one, I like the way they look and bought one for my boat, haven't installed it yet,  lots of my friends like to lay up there, maybe sleep,  with their boat cushions, blankets, chairs, jackets off, stuff like that on a lazy day of motoring, once in a while something will go overboard, and I thought "why didn't I have a net"?with me it has nothing to do with kids.  "my 2 cents" Bob