windlass to be purchased. questions, suggestions

[kerk fisher]

We want to buy a windlass for our new 1990 34' purchase. Some questions:
1. I noticed that some boats that I've seen pictured have only a drum/capstan. Is it possible a chain can be pulled up without a gypsy?
2.  I've gathered that a vertical is better than horizontal? Big difference? Is it worth it to go vertical?
3.  What makes and models do people like and what to avoid? What's the best source for good prices?
4. I have an unused anchor line from our 25', but it's only 9/16.  Seems small. What line and chain size do you recommend?
5. Do you recommend a separate 12v battery for the windlass? Where do you put it? What else would that battery power? Boat was bought with 1 12 v starting and 2 6v house. What beefing up is suggested?

We are new 34 owners and this website is fabulous.  My wife and I would be lost without all your help!!! Thanks, thanks, thanks.  Kerk and Freddie

[Mike Smith]

Welcome Aboard, Captain Kerk!

Here is a link to my Anchor Windlass Project

http://www.c34.org/projects/projects-anchor-windlass.html

Beam Me Up, Scotty!
Mike

[Ron Hill]

Kerk : Your boat has an anchor well that was made to accept a windlass, where Mike's was not.  
I'd call Catalina and get their plans for installation of a windlass in a 1990 C34.  Then you can have a "like" factory installation.  I'd get both a drum and a gypsy.  
I'm sure that you'll get a whole bunch of advice.  

[Ted Pounds]

Kerk,

9/16 should be big enough.  I have 1/2 on mine with 20 feet of chain at the anchor.

[Ken Juul]

Kerk,

As Ron said, the 90's boats were set up for a horizontal Windlass inside the anchor well.  Not sure if mine is factory installed or by a PO, but I think it works great.  All the mess stays in the anchor well, easy to clean up using the drain.  Additionally one less thing to trip over on the fore deck.  I have a house bank of 2 deep cycle and a starting battery.  Power for the windlass are long cable runs, using battery cable sized wire.   I don't think a seperate battery is necessary as I always start the engine before pulling the anchor.  Even if I am going to sail from the anchorage, having the engine running is a good safety backup and or battery recharge.  I just have a drum, I have run a 1/2" line from just above the rope/chain connection down to the eye on the anchor.  The line is slack enough so the chain takes the weight of the boat, but I can wrap the line around the capstan and let the chain fall into the well.  Someone else on the site first described the process, a search for should turn it up.

At one time I had pictures of the installation, if I can find them I let you know.

[jentine]

Kerk, In answer to your questions, I think that you should decide whether you plan to anchor on all chain or rope/chain combination.  All chain requires the installation of a windlass with a gypsy.  Wrapping chain around a capstan is cumbersome, difficult to handle and damaging to the capstan surface.  As to the orientation, Catalina has used both configurations in various years.  I think that they finally opted for the vertical because of the lead of the chain into the pawls and out, into the chain locker.  My former vessel had a Maxwell capstan (with a 90A circuit breaker) that was more than capable of handling the anchor line in all conditions.  I never had any problems with it other than distressing the surface with chain.
I would recommend 1/2" anchor line and 5/16" Hi-tensile chain.  Both are slight overkill, but good ground tackle is cheap insurance.
As for the battery, I recommend putting a battery in the bow as close to the windlass as possible.  It is much cheaper to install a battery and run a small conductor to the battery to charge it than to run 00 battery cable the length of the boat.
Good luck.

Jim Kane

[Randy and Mary Davison]

Ken,

I couldn't spot the thread on using line in parallel with chain but am very interested in the idea.  I've been pulling chain around the capstan when the going gets tough but would prefer not to.  I use a boat length of chain and a half inch rode.

If you don't mind repeating...How did you attach the line at both ends?  I could experiment but I'd rather learn from experience.  Also, why doesn't the line wrap around the chain, making it difficult to sort out as you bring in the pair together?  

Thanks.

[Stu Jackson]

Randy

I had our rigger install a rope to chain splice.  Now our Bruce comes up over the anchor roller, albeit by hand since we don't have a windlass, much more smoothly.  Lots has been written about rope to chain splices, but it sure beats the old shackle that used to get hung up, and with 1/2 line and either 1/4 or 3/8 or in between sized chain (I forget the size of chain), it's always a clean hoist.  The argument about the splice has always been about its strength.  We've had no problems and we check it, along with the chain to anchor connector, on a regular basis.  Getting rid of shackles is half the battle.

[Randy and Mary Davison]

Hi Stu,

Actually, I was referring to the post by Ken Juul about 3 or 4 up where he describes having a length of line running next to the chain - so it's attached above the line/chain splice or shackle and then runs down to the anchor eye in parallel with the chain.  As he describes it, he's able to run the line on the capstan while the chain falls into the locker.   It's an interesting idea.

Thanks,

[Ken Juul]

To be honest with you, I have installed but not yet tested it in water deeper than the slip.  I attached the end at the anchor with a bowline and the the other end I used a rolling hitch and seizing to secure the bitter end.  The assist rope is loose enough for the chain to take all the tension, but not sloppy loose.  I think the theory is any twists will work their way out as the anchor is hanging.

Will try to find the post that made the suggestion, may have been on the Catalinaowners board.

[kerk fisher]

Almost ready to do the maxwell inside the locker when I read that when it's horizontal you have to take it apart to check the oil.  Has this been a real drawback? Also considering the Lewmar (which is cheaper) but the Maxwell has a larger drum and looks sturdier, but twice the price. Any thoughts?

[Ken Juul]

That is something I will have to figure out.  The one time I had the access panel down it looked like the gearbox was grease filled.  I don't have an operator's manual.  Guess I'll have to do some checking this spring during recommissioning.

[Jim Price]

Just another opinion.  I have "overkill" 3/4 rode with 35 feet heavy chain (PO was rigging for offshore) now going to FX - 16 Fortress.  I installed a West Marine SS Swivel Connector that moves in both vertical and horizontal planes at anchor and chain connection with no shackle and I sliced the 3/4 line to chain to eliminate hang up on bow roller.  Works very smoothly.  Just have to check splice condition periodically.

I also added secondary line attached to anchor flukes head that I set with a buoy above anchor.  This is an "anchor saver" here where we have an interesting bottom.  Allows me to pull the flukes out backward from whatever they are hung on and then raise the anchor.  The winch can be used to pull this line also to break the anchor free but I have never found the need to use that.  Just use the wince to raise the anchor with its extra 60 lbs of mud!

[Ken Juul]

Haven't been able to fing the post that gave me the idea, but did find this one that has another method.

http://www.c34.org/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=167&highlight=anchor+rope

[Randy and Mary Davison]

Thanks Ken.

I'm going to experiment a bit this spring.  I've been using the still-chromed windlass to haul the chain since we bought the boat in '97.  No signs of chrome coming off yet.