teak/holly sole

[Jeff Kaplan]

i took up the old sole on my 1986 #219 because it has deteriorated. the lumber yards in the ma. area all stock 1/4, 1/2 and 3/4" teak holly ply but not the needed 3/8". can anybody suggest a source on the east coast where i can order 3/8". i have a mill to do the cut. i called catalina  for info and they have a ca. company called h&h who did the original flooring. i called them but they weren't eager to do the cut, plus i would have to ship the old sole across the country so they could use it as a template. any info would be greatly appreciated. thanks and happy newyear...jeff kaplan

[SteveLyle]

I did a Google search on "teak holly plywood" and found the attached:

http://www.worldpanel.com/ - this company is in Florida.

[Gene Regan]

http://www.hardwoodint.com/marharplyw.html

Good luck

[captran]

You have probably already thought of this, but one alternative to shipping H&L the actual wood would be to use newspaper cut out to use as a template.    But you got the same feeling as me when I talked to them, that they really seem like they are not very anxious for the small jobs.  They told me I'm better off going local.  I was interested in just getting 2 face half inch teak to replace cabinets.  I have two areas with a slight discoloration on the floor but a carpenter told me to just leave it alone unless I refinish the entire floor.  good luck with your project

[mike lofstrom]

Jeff:  I faced the same dilemma with "Cat Tales" last year.  My boat is a 1992.  The previous owner must have had a dog, because the floors were trashed when I bought the boat.  3/8ths or 10MM Teak and Holly is really hard to find.  I found a local yard that had 1/2 inch.  if you measure it, you will probably find that it is really 7/16ths.  If so, It will work fine.  That's what I used.  it takes two sheets of 4x8, and they were about $200 per sheet at the local yard.  I did the rest of the work myself.   The 7/16ths material will sit slightly above the "pockets" in the fiberglass hull liner, but the difference is not noticeable.  I put a slight radius on the top edges of the new floors to help prevent the edges from chipping.  So far, it has not been a problem.    When you re-make the floors,  I highly recommend that you trial fit them before you start the varnishing.  Mine took several trips between the garage and boat before I was ready to varnish.  I used 6 coats of Epifanes gloss, and 2 coats of Epifanes matte.  You will be amazed at how much better the interior of your boat will look with the new floors.  I think you will also be amazed at how clumsy you will get when holding large heavy objects in the cabin when you have new floors!    I now have several nice imprints of winch handles,  main hatch padlock, etc.  in the new floors!   Good luck with your project, it really makes a huge difference in the interior of the boat.

[Mike Vaccaro]

Jeff,

A couple of thoughts--if your floor isn't too trashed but just the finish is bad or the wood is stained, you might consider refinishing.  A finish stripper makes quick work of removing the old varnish and a good teak cleaner will brighten the wood.  You can refinish one section at a time.  "Dings" in the wood can be filled with expoy filler mixed with teak sawdust (if you care about their appearance) or any epoxy filler if you don't.  

Whether you refinish or replace, you might consider using a product called "CDPE," clear, deep penetrating epoxy to protect the floor pieces.  In the case of teak plywood, this is not so much to prevent rot as it is to help maintain the finish and prevent staining.  You can apply varnish over the top of the epoxy.  Two or three coats of expoy can be applied in a single day, but you'll need to let a day or two after the last coat elapse before you varnish (depending on ambient temperature).  You can research CDPE and other expoy/wood questions at:

http://www.rotdoctor.com/L/BoatL/Bqa.html

Another option is to replace the wood with a new, high-tech floor, similar to the one that is used in new boats.  You give up some of the warmth of wood, but it's a more durable, plastic based material that doesn't require maintenance, other than cleaning, and is more resistant to scuffing and damage from dropped objects.  

The original floor in the Mark 1 was designed to be cut from a single sheet of 4 x 8 ply to keep costs down (this doesn't include the bilge covers which are made from thicker stock).  I can't confirm this, but suspect that the basic floor pan shape hasn't changed much over the years, so a current production floor may be identical or nearly so to an older floor.  A previous post in this thread implies that H&L doesn't have templates.  It MAY be more cost effective to buy a pre-cut replacement floor if the alternative is to buy two sheets of ply.  A query to Catalina parts might shed some light on this.  

Best of luck,

Mike

[captran]

Thanks for posting the link Mike.  Now I have something to keep me busy new years eve.

As to help or advice from Catalina, (and I'm trying not to be too negative) is that Jeff is likely better off researching on his own via this great resource on this site.  I have called Catalina many times this fall.  If there is a technical question (how parts are installed, like interior siding, cabinets, bulkheads, flooring, what type of varnish or how applied, etc) Parts refers me to Kent Nelson.  He must be a very busy person because he doesn't return calls.  I was really quite surprised that he finally returned an E mail on December 27.  My E mail to him was November 1.  His response  to my question about varnish was to just "contact Jeff at Target Coatings".  My question about attachment of bulkheads, cabinets, etc, asking if there are diagrams available went unaddressed except to say they use cleats and to "take a look at how your current parts are installed and match that for installing the new pieces."  I must admit that any answer two months later, while not especially helpful, was a pleasant surprise.  That's why I suggest that we are pretty much on our own.

I would think that with any boat under production for so long there would be detailed information available, but from my experience that is not the case.  That's why this site and others experience is so valuable.

Thanks again,

Randy Thies
Voyager 1345

[mike lofstrom]

Jeff:  Just a few more points.  The bilge covers are constructed from double layers of the floor material.  They can be made by using two layers of the floor material and some epoxy.    You should also put a couple of coats of varnish on the back sides of all of the floors as a sealer.  The factory does not do this, and it makes the edges of the floors prone to de-lamination.  Mine were de-laminated near the head entrance.  

Cheers!

[Paul Bosquet]

At my visit to Catalina in Florida last December, I picked up a sample of what they now use for the flooring. It is a Formica type flooring that will last forever.
LONSEAL 800 832 7111
http://www.lonsealspecialty.com/lonwdteakholly.html#


Paul

[Mike Smith]

First - Happy New Year to all!

I have often thought this would be a perfect niche market for someone with local access to teak and holly material and a modestly equipped woodworking shop.  Since all Mark I and Mark II sole plans are identical, it could be an economical alternative to everyone paying for expensive, one-off custom jobs all around the country, and you'd sure have a captive customer base!  So, how about it, woodworkers?  If you can make a beautiful mahogony cockpit insert, you can surely cut out flooring for the Catalina 34!

Mike

[Stu Jackson]

Mike

Great idea!

It might even be easier than that:  most of the soles do NOT wear in the forward cabin / V berth, aft cabin, under the saloon table and under the nav station.

Sooo, we're looking at maybe two to five pieces:  the galley, the long runner in the saloon and the three over the bilge.

Sure would be a winner to start pumping those out!  

Could probably get three boat's worth out of one 4x8...

[Ron Hill]

Not to sure that ALL C34 soles are the same - especially between the MK I and MK II.
Most of us have some kind of "rug" down in the galley and the main cabin.  As Stu mentioned the pieces that really get wear are the 2 pieces in the galley and the long piece in the main cabin walkway.

Most times that I've dropped a screwdriver/tool it has been my luck that:
1. It never lands handle down
2. It misses the rug

Figure that!!  

[Tom Glennon]

Jeff, try Boulter Plywood in Somerville 617-666-1340  www.boulterplywood.com   They have the absolute best in marine woods.  Exotics too, planed, raw, etc.

[Jeff Kaplan]

thank you all for the replies given as to where to get 3/8 teak/holly ply. as stated, all the mills carry 1/4" and 1/2". i took the website submitted by steve lyle, www.worldpanel.com,in fl. i contacted them and they stock all sizes including 3/8's in 2 grades, best 1mm face and premium 2mm face. after talking to them i elected to purchase the better grade as this will allow better sandability and longer life. they crated it today and are shipping it directly to the lumber yard that has my old sole so they will mill it for me. the owner of the yard was pleased that he didn't have to look anymore for me, as marine woods aren't really their business, and had no problem with the millwright just doing the labor. once the wood has been cut, i will hope for a mild day so i can partially uncover the boat to get in cabin for trial fit. once done, i can then seal the bottom and sides of ply before finishing the top. as was stated in the replies, an enterprising woodworker could probably do very well cutting out  a supply of this flooring, as i can only assume i am not the only one in need of new flooring. once the project is completed i will take pictures and post. thanks again...jeff kaplan

[Stu Jackson]

Jeff

Nice job, and good luck with the millwright.

I recommend that when you complete your pictures and story, send them to Mark Elkin our Projects associate webmaster.  He can take your material and post it on the Projects page.  The pictures will come out better and will always be there for folks to see, where this board (while continuous back on its 63 or so pages and always always available by scrolling/clicking/searching) only shows the last month's material when it pops up.

Happy dancing on your new sole.