Messages

Anyone know where I can find the torque specs for the damper plate bolts?

Edit:
Ended up using the parts manual to determine what exact bolt was being used on the damper plates.  Then based on that I could read the quality? number on the bolt.  With both of those pieces of information I was able to look it up in standard google searches.

Update: Removal of engine and transmission

Not a lot of comments to share, it went really well.  No 'problems' to solve.  All bolts cooperated.  My brother-in-law started about 1:30 and by 6:30 we were cleaned up and heading for dinner.

Now I am cleaning, installing insulation, hoses, HX boiled/tested, alternator tested, re-doing the wire harness (yes this should have been done long ago), etc.

I have all the parts and hopefully we can start re-installing later this week.

Thinking about a new alternator, since we need to re-route the circuit anyway.  Any thoughts on a 105 amp replacement?

What about torque specs for things?
- Federal flex coupler
- Bell housing
- Engine mount bolts
- ???

Phew.... I thought I was really off.
(as you can tell, I am in way over my head on this stuff)

Thanks
Not sure why I didn't think of that.

I am going to attempt to replace my hot water tank hoses.

I am going to follow Stu's method of draining the coolant by un-clamping the hose coming off the fresh water pump at the elbow joint and catching in a bucket.
https://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4518.msg26462.html#msg26462

But how do I drain the coolant in the hoses heading to the hot water tank?  They are fed by 3/8" hoses off the top of the fresh water pump and the thermostat and head down and connect to the long 5/8" hoses before heading under the floor pan.  So they are above the section being drained and I assume will be full.

How do I not make a mess? ;>)

KWKloeber,
In my case, changing out the transmission to a ZF12M which has a 10mm output shaft drop from crank, I need to raise my engine 10mm, correct?

But that was already stated, so I am not understanding you post.

If the engine stays in the exact same position, won't it be out of alignment because to get the shaft to attach, it will have to angle down a bit?

Thanks for all the replies.  I ended up settling on the ZF12m just because of the majority of information on the net and a local sales rep to talk/work with.

Purchased:
- ZF12M transmission from Harbor Marine in Everett, WA
   - Important differences when compared to HBW 50 transmission
      -  Front to back (L + L3) : +37mm (+1.46")
      -  Output shaft drop from crank: +10mm (.39")
      -  Reduction ratio 12M vs HBW 50: 2.14:1 vs. 2.05:1
- Damper plate - 1866-050-002 (hope it fits)
- Vetus K-75 motor mounts
- Federal flexible coupler
- Exhaust Heat Riser and extra gaskets - TODO
- Hot water tank hoses 5/8" metal re-enforced

Process (boat is in the water):
- Days/week before, use pb blaster in a cup w/ q-tips to apply to existing bolts (especially the exhaust riser.
- Pretty much follow this post: https://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,293.msg941.html#msg941
- Drain coolant (prep for removing exhaust riser, replacing hoses)
- Lift the engine/trans and move forward into the companion way
- Make a template/marks for where the current motor mounts are located
- Replace motor mounts adding 10mm shim (yellow passivated steel) to raise the engine (required for new trans) (oak or metal?)
- Replace hot water tank hoses
- Remove existing hard coupler
- Replace transmission
- Install old hard coupler (to use for alignment)
- Paint engine
- Replace remaining hard to get to engine wall insulation
- Spray Boeshield T9 on transmission
- Measure and mark the shaft for the position it needs to be moved back to (transmission is 1.5" longer):  Will be removing the old hard coupler and drive saver and replacing w/ the smaller federal flex coupler.  So will need to probably move back 1/2" (TBD).
- Install new Clamp-Collar on the drive shaft (so it doesn't fall out)
- Remove the setscrews in the PSS so the drive shaft can be pushed backwards (someone could hold the bellows to help reduce water ingress)
- Push back (temporary) insert a couple existing set screws/re-adjust Clamp-Collar
- Install engine/transmission
- Install new exhaust riser and new hump hose (TBD)
- Adjust shaft into old hard coupler and re-use keyway, setscrew holes (use old PSS set screws/re-adjust Clamp-Collar)
- Align engine
- Replace old hard coupler w/ new flex coupler, using existing keyway and setscrew holes (this may or may not work???) - mitigation: continue to use old hard coupler for couple years until boat is pulled
- Install new PSS set screws w/ drive shaft in its final position

Year or two later:
- Pull boat (standard bottom paint etc)
- Measure distance from prop to strut, how much do I need to cut to get this down to 1"
- Press out cutlass bearing
- Pull prop and shaft
- Send off to be cut, re-key way and fit to new federal flex coupler (research pitch on prop because of transmission ratio?)
- Re-install shaft, new PSS set screws, re-align engine in water

Will update with how it actually goes down

Good to know.
As you can tell, I tend to overthink things (computer engineer not mechanical/handy) ;>)

Going to be raising my engine and wonder if I should be replacing my oil pan while I am in there... just because.

I did have some corrosion from my raw water pump but mostly just surface, but who knows.

Great picture Noah...
Sorry for your loss, cherish the memories

Thanks Ron.

I had read your posts and I am planning on using the 4x4 w/ a come along / harness.  After I am done, the final engine needs to be raised 10mm higher.  Was wondering how people do this.  Someone said wood shims and that doesn't seem right.  I don't see metal shims to purchase so I guess you have these 'made' by someone?  I then assumed they would want to know what type of metal the mounts would be that they are touching.

Found Vetus's phone number: 410-712-0740
yellow passivated steel

I just purchased Vetus k-75 motor mounts and need to raise my engine height by 10mm for a new transmission.

How does one raise their engine?
Are there metal shims you can purchase or do you have to just make them?

Does anyone know the metal type in the Vetus motor mounts?  I couldn't find a good web site or phone number to inquire directly.

I called Federal Marine Transmission to ask some questions and order their flexible coupler.
https://federalmarinetransmissions.com/contact.html
708-352-2200 (Jim)

He was very knowledgable and provided a lot of history.
It ended up being part # 43A w/ 1" diameter. about $380
https://0201.nccdn.net/1_2/000/000/0d7/d2a/2022--federal-flexible-couplings.pdf
The part has to be 'made' which takes about a week.
No mention of a grounding strap.
He said to continue to use the existing old stiff coupler for initial transmission / shaft alignment, then re-install this flexible coupler.

Question/confirmation about the use of a key way.
I said I would be cutting off the front of my shaft and would likely be loosing the key way and that I had heard the key way was not required.  He was very adamant that the key way is still required.  I mentioned others had success w/ out the key way and he said the only thing he could think of is that they were using the set screws to tighten against the shaft and this wasn't correct.  ????
He said the shaft should be pulled, sent off w/ the coupler, re keyed and re-drilled for set screws and fit the new flex coupler to the shaft.  He said every shaft is different, like a fingerprint and could be off by a 1K of an inch, etc.

So, now my big concern is the key way.  @Ron Hill - I know you have had success, any thoughts?

Now my current thoughts are to get in there and get an exact measurement of my current hard coupler + drive saver.  This should be bigger (longer) than the new Federal flex coupler (2 11/16"???).  So how much bigger?  I need to find 1.5" for the longer transmission.  I am guessing I still need to shorten the shaft 1/2". 

If I need to pull the shaft and re-cut a key way, I have to for sure pull the boat, cut out the cutlas, pull the shaft back past the rudder, have the shaft properly cut down to account for the prop length behind the strut etc. Reapply bottom paint, etc. (did all this 2 years ago).

Maybe, for now, just simply push the shaft back the 1/2" (making the prop / strut distance worse), but maybe 'this' can be done safely in the water?  This would buy me another year (bottom paint, $, time).  So thoughts on experiences/safety of just pushing the shaft back a bit while in the water?  Or are all the risks the same?

I am glad this helped you out.

I for sure don't have any knowledge or experience, just lots of googling and reading c34.org.  I am a computer guy.  Haven't had a lot a chances to get my hands greasy and I tend to over think, over research and freeze in the headlights of "I can never do this, may as well sink the boat...."

Good to know about TriCounty and the Universal M25XP, do you have a mechanic name?  I don't have a local mechanic contact.  My brother-in-law helps but he is 2 hours away so don't like to lean on him too much.

Nice to know there are other C34 member/owners around the marina (Gate 6)