I am finding that my Main Halyard is very difficult to raise and lower. I have looked at previous posts on this subject and have a list of things to investigate the possible cause (i.e. raising the halyard without the main to discern the problem lies in the track or main and not the mast head sheaves) I intend to do my checks this weekend, and hopefully the issue will be corrected with a liberal application of sailkote to the track.
My question is this: If the problem appears to be with the sheaves at the top of the mast, is it an absolutely necessity to drop the mast to effect repairs and install new sheaves? Or, can a rigger (or myself) install new (Ball bearing) sheaves without having to go through the expense. Has anyone heard of this being done and the issues involved?
I'm finding myself utterly dependent on the wealth of knowledge I receive here in the proper care and feeding of Pau Hana :santa
Kevin...had the same problem with a c30 once. The lube didn't help. Unless you want to invest in a track and car system, you might want to install a block at masthead and another on mainsail headboard to add purchase to assist raising main. Only disadvantage is you have twice the halyard length but would sure be a good remedy. All this is assuming your masthead sheave is in good condition. If it needs replacing it can be done at masthead without unstepping mast. Good luck
Kevin,
I can refer you to a rigger in SD that I have been happy with if you want to use one.
Mike
Kevin- We've noticed the same thing on 2nd Wish. In our case there seems to be 2 issues. 1) Sail track fouling (near the boom) due to a recent mast repainting and 2) binding at the base of the mast near the turning block. Can you raise the sail easily by hand at the mast? If so, the problem is the turning block or further back. If not, the sail track or mast sheave. Our surveyor recommended replacing the turning block with a ball bearing type- 1987 model has no bearing. Its on the list...
T
Kevin,
To answer you question. Glad you asked.
If the problem appears to be with the sheaves at the top of the mast, is it an absolutely necessity to drop the mast to effect repairs and install new sheaves? Or, can a rigger (or myself) install new (Ball bearing) sheaves without having to go through the expense.
The answer is you or a rigger can do it in the air with out pulling the stick. It is pretty easy to remove the mast cap and the pin for the sheave from what I recall when I put the ball bearing sheave in.
Putting the sheave in did help however still need to winch up the last 2 feet or so unless I am raising the main at the mast in which Ii can raise all the way. I believe the angle at which the deck turning block to the mast block is culprit. I have not figured out a change to fix that. Has any one put in the bearing turning block on deck? Would like to hear from others who may have fixed this.
My main does not come all the way down even with sail cote. It comes about 2/3 down then we need to pull rest of the way. The halyard moves freely with no issues. Sail slugs seem to glide with no issue. Would be interested if others have been able to get their sail completely up with out winching and down completely with out a using down haul or having a track system installed. So all the way up and down from the cock pit . What is the trick???
Thanks
Rick
Think of where the points of friction are in the system:
1. The sail slugs and the track
2. The sheaves at the top of the mast
3. The turning block at the base of the mast
4. The deck organizer block
Take them one at a time, since they could be different on all boats. The sail slug issue has been discussed in the previous answers. Others, like me, have tracks instead of using the mast slot. My boat came that way from the PO. I was lucky! One thing not mentioned is lubing the track.
I replaced all of my deck organizer blocks with new ones from Garhauer.
I still need to replace my block at the base of the mast, to match all the new mainsheet blocks I got from Garhauer.
I don't know what sheaves I have up top - I blew it by not replacing them when we pulled the stick in 2003.
So take 'em one at a time.
Dave Davis, IIRC, moved his deck organizers aft some to reduce the "angle of attack" which he says helped a lot. Do an advanced search on organizer with Dave Davis and see if you can find the topic he posted.
You might end up finding out anywhere from one to all being the "culprit."
Kevin I have the same problem. I changed the mast head sheeve with a Garhauer rolling bearing. Yes I believe you have to step the mast to get the cap off. I may be wrong but I think the forstay and backstay attach to the cap. I also put rolling bearing at the turning block and deck organizer. It helped about 10%. I had to put a larger and more powerful winch to help. The problem is to many turns and the angle of the deck organizer. The better sail track might help. I haven't done that . Charlie
Kevin : Look at page 4.1.5 of your owners manual and you see what Sailaway is telling you. To change the mast head halyard sheaves the mast needs to be down!! The mast cap must be removed to access the halyard sheaves.
I'll guess that you could leave the upper shrouds in place, slack off on the head stay & back stay and remove the mast cap. Got a hunch it's better to just remove the mast and probably less $$ than hiring a rigger to do that job - as I believe most of us are not capable of doing that task !!
As Stu mentioned you first need to try the main halyard line to see if it runs freely with out a load - checking out the top of the mast (non BB sheaves) - it could be frozen!! Then you need ball bearing sheaves in the blocks at the base of the mast and the BB turning blocks on the deck because each cuts down friction.
As Dave Davis did route the halyard from the base of the mast direct to the coach top winch - that cuts some friction from the turning block. You might also look at the fairleads under the traveler and make sure they have space for your size halyard line.
Lastly, lube (dry Teflon) the mainsail track in the mast. A few thoughts
Kevin,
I apologize as I was incorrect you do have to take mast down as sailaway and Ron pointed out. I missed the fact that some of the stays are attached to the mast head cap as I changed to ball bearing sheave when mast was down and remembered it to be very simple job.
Rick
Thanks everyone for the great input. It's supposed to rain this weekend so I don't know how much work I'll get done on this investigation but I already know a couple of things:
1. If the mast sheaves need to be replaced ... the mast has to come down.... I hope the sheaves are good $$$. Since I'm planning a haul out in the early spring for bottom paint, that might be a good time to drop the mast as well.
2. I know for certain the turning blocks (4) at the mast base are ball bearing.... not likely to be suspect but still will be checked.
3. Thank you Stu!!... I didn't even think of the deck organizers. I'll check to see if they are ball bearing but I already know it appears they are at an acute angle to the mast and blocks. Moving those organizers a bit aft would seem to be a good project regardless but I think it is likely beyond my scope.
4. Sail lugs and track. I am really hoping one of these two to be the culprits. I know for certain the PO had the mast painted. (the PO also had upgraded the turning blocks, stays and shrouds and I'm hoping the sheaves as well). I can easily apply some dry lube to the lugs but if I need to lube the track are there some good methods to do so?
5. If all checks out and its simply a sticky track and lugs... taking it to the next step... how difficult or effective is it to upgrade to a track type system like the Harken Batt Cars... I would love to have the Main easy enough to raise and lower that the Admiral could do it effortlessly, without my brute strength (although I'm not much of a brut) :santa
There are some references to painting of the mast track as though it is a detriment to smooth sail raising. Painting the mast may be good or bad depending on the level of preparation and the quality of the paint job. I sanded my track absolutely smooth to bare metal with new primer and paint professionally applied. I also added a new main with new slides, replaced the bushings in the sheaves, new ball bearing turning block, and new deck organizers. It's now an easy pull by hand up to the last few feet. Very smooth with very little friction in the system. I wouldn't be bothered installing cars if you gave them to me.
Since I did everything at once, I don't know which was the biggest contributor to friction - my guess would be the slides in the track. Track can be sanded without de-masting or repainting and slides are easily replaced.
Kevin : Call Garhauer Marine and tell them you want 4 top of the mast halyard ball bearing sheaves.
I pulled the mast over 10 years ago and as I recall those BB sheaves were not that expensive.
Take a look at the Mainsheet tech notes to see my article on "pulling the deck stepped mast" and installing a Hinkley TV antenna (Aug 2001). There are all kind of things you might want to do with the mast down.
I've listed items to be done, in the mast pulling article. Good luck
Kevin, If you're going to pull the stick to replace the sheaves that will be a perfect opportunity to inspect the track. I would suggest some 500 grit emery paper on a sail slug and run it up and down the track. Then a good dry lube like McLube or Elmers spayed liberally in the track. Then run a slug up down to test the final product. Just a thought...
Kevin,
I just got off the phone with my rigger and he says that the sheaves can be replaced with the mast up.
Give him a call if you want. His name is Casey at KC Performance Rigging phone 619-224-1636 at 1670 Hettner Blvd.
If you have other reasons for pulling the mast, that's fine but if you just want to replace the sheaves, I think it would at least worth talking to Casey.
Good Luck,
Mike
Thank You Mike!!!
I have a call out Casey right now and I'll be talking to him soon :clap
All sheaves and hardware should be replaced with ball bearing units. I have a full batten main and replaced the batten slides with cars, each one had 4 cute little wheels. Works great now!!
Kevin:
I'd be VERY interested in what your rigger says. I just purchased masthead sheaves from Garhauer and I've been racking my brains trying to figure out a way of replacing them without pulling the mast. Please keep us updated.
Dave
Quote from: David Urscheler on December 15, 2010, 04:10:38 PM
Kevin:
I'd be VERY interested in what your rigger says. I just purchased masthead sheaves from Garhauer and I've been racking my brains trying to figure out a way of replacing them without pulling the mast. Please keep us updated.
Dave
The rigger would need to go up, lash a block to the mast and rig a temporary halyard, come back down, loosen off forestay and backstay, go back up on the temp halyard, disconnect forestay and backstay, pull the cap, replace the sheaves, without dropping the halyards down the mast, and reverse the process. I wouldn't want to do it at sea :D
Quote from: crieders on December 15, 2010, 03:50:45 PM
All sheaves and hardware should be replaced with ball bearing units.
Why should the sheaves be ball bearing? I experienced moderate wear on bushings in 20 years - will lead to some chatter and friction, but the maintenance interval (before friction is a problem) is probably longer than the rigging life. Near zero chance of complete failure in this application where maintenance is a bit challenging.
What gives you the confidence that the ball bearings will hold up as well in this application? What is the failure mode and what are the consequences?
Maybe I'm just conservative, but I think it's worth thinking about before deciding. Ball bearings are a clear winner in a block at deck level. I wasn't convinced at the masthead.
I've been biting my tongue on this long enough. I replaced the masthead sheaves on my C36 about 10 years ago with the mast up. Yes, it can be done. You need a helper on deck that you absolutely trust and knows exactly what the two of you are doing. It also needs to be done in perfectly calm water at the dock. Let me see if I can remember the details.
Build a platform made of 4 boards that fit around the mast, with matching holes on the corners, with an 8-10' line on each corner. Sturdy enough to stand on. Bring it to the masthead with a bosun's chair, also wearing a harness with tether. At the masthead, tie the platform around the mast, at a height comfortable for working at the masthead. The upper shrouds are attached to the mast about a foot below the masthead with a thru-bolt. Tie all lines around the mast, above that thru-bolt, below the masthead. Once the platform is secure, attach your tether to the mast securely, and stand on the platform. Now comes the fun part. Using a messenger line, pull up a line long enough to go from the top of the mast, back to a snatch block at a stern cleat, then forward to the primaries (jib sheet?). Attach the line to the mast above the thru-bolt and take up the slack. Do the same with a line to a forward cleat. With the primaries, make the lines as tight as possible. They will be your substitute forestay and backstay. Once they are tight, have your helper loosen the turnbuckles for the backstay and forestay. When they are loose, you can take out the pin holding them to the masthead. Don't drop them, but use a spare piece of line, tie it to the upper ends of the forestay and backstay, and lower the ends down a few feet. At this point the mast should be supported by the shrouds (which you haven't touched), plus the temporary forestay and temporary backstay. Standing on the platform, you can take all your weight off the halyard that you came up on. Now you can take the masthead fitting off. Be carefull not to drop the halyards. Remove the old sheaves. Install the new sheaves. Reinstall the masthead. Reinstall the forestay and backstay. Have your helper tighten the turnbuckles. Reattach your bosun's chair to the halyard. Take off the temporary forestay and backstay. Take off the platform. Return to the deck, and you are done. I hope I haven't missed a step, and I hope you get the idea. You've got to support the mast, and you've got to support yourself without the use of a halyard. Definitely not to be done at sea.
Quote from: Kevin Henderson on December 15, 2010, 07:37:54 AM
4. Sail lugs and track. I am really hoping one of these two to be the culprits. I know for certain the PO had the mast painted. (the PO also had upgraded the turning blocks, stays and shrouds and I'm hoping the sheaves as well). I can easily apply some dry lube to the lugs but if I need to lube the track are there some good methods to do so?
Kevin, if you manage to avoid pulling the stick, take a couple cotton balls saturated (like dripping) with Sailkote and stuff them in the track above the headboard the next couple of times you raise the main...and periodically thereafter...it'll get better every time...
Quote from: Tom Soko on December 15, 2010, 06:08:10 PM
I've been biting my tongue on this long enough. I replaced the masthead sheaves on my C36 about 10 years ago with the mast up. Yes, it can be done. You need a helper on deck that you absolutely trust and knows exactly what the two of you are doing. It also needs to be done in perfectly calm water at the dock. Let me see if I can remember the details.
Build a platform made of 4 boards that fit around the mast, with matching holes on the corners, with an 8-10' line on each corner. Sturdy enough to stand on. Bring it to the masthead with a bosun's chair, also wearing a harness with tether. At the masthead, tie the platform around the mast, at a height comfortable for working at the masthead. The upper shrouds are attached to the mast about a foot below the masthead with a thru-bolt. Tie all lines around the mast, above that thru-bolt, below the masthead. Once the platform is secure, attach your tether to the mast securely, and stand on the platform. Now comes the fun part. Using a messenger line, pull up a line long enough to go from the top of the mast, back to a snatch block at a stern cleat, then forward to the primaries (jib sheet?). Attach the line to the mast above the thru-bolt and take up the slack. Do the same with a line to a forward cleat. With the primaries, make the lines as tight as possible. They will be your substitute forestay and backstay. Once they are tight, have your helper loosen the turnbuckles for the backstay and forestay. When they are loose, you can take out the pin holding them to the masthead. Don't drop them, but use a spare piece of line, tie it to the upper ends of the forestay and backstay, and lower the ends down a few feet. At this point the mast should be supported by the shrouds (which you haven't touched), plus the temporary forestay and temporary backstay. Standing on the platform, you can take all your weight off the halyard that you came up on. Now you can take the masthead fitting off. Be carefull not to drop the halyards. Remove the old sheaves. Install the new sheaves. Reinstall the masthead. Reinstall the forestay and backstay. Have your helper tighten the turnbuckles. Reattach your bosun's chair to the halyard. Take off the temporary forestay and backstay. Take off the platform. Return to the deck, and you are done. I hope I haven't missed a step, and I hope you get the idea. You've got to support the mast, and you've got to support yourself without the use of a halyard. Definitely not to be done at sea.
That is just plain impressive as boat projects go IMHO
Quote from: Joe Kern on December 15, 2010, 06:21:39 PM
That is just plain impressive as boat projects go IMHO
Yeah...tough one to beat, no doubt...hats off to that solution Tom. I suspect the rum would taste REAL good with that one behind you... :D
Another option if you can get the boat docked next to land is to use a cherry picker or linesman bucket rather than building the platform. The rest of the steps are the same.
Tom..... You Sir... are my hero. I'm afraid that if I even attempted to do what you had done it would be a sure and certain death. :wink:
Ron... I looked in the owners manual and would concur on the face of it that it appears the Fore and Aft Stays would have to be disconnected... It also appears that some folks have come up with some ingenious ways to "skin the cat" so to speak.
Mike.... Thank you for the reference. I have an appointment with Casey at KC performance rigging on Tuesday. Casey is going to come over and perform an overall inspection, but we will focus and discuss the mast sheaves and possible solutions afterwards.
To all.... Thank you very much for all the input and insight... This forum and the association is an invaluable asset and wealth of knowledge. I will be certain to report to everyone the results of the inspection and the verdict on solutions to improving the issue with the Main sticking.
BTW... I'm still going to WM tonight and buying up a jug of SailKote... and hoping for the best :thumb:
Quote from: Kevin Henderson on December 16, 2010, 09:47:17 AM
Ron... I looked in the owners manual and would concur on the face of it that it appears the shrouds would have to be disconnected... It also appears that some folks have come up with some ingenious ways to "skin the cat" so to speak.
Your shrouds would not have to be disconnected. They are attached on tangs that are thru bolted below the masthead. However, if your rigger does remove the box ask him to have a look down inside at the compression sleeve on that thru-bolt. I had a compression sleeve that was 3/4" too short as though it came out of the C30 parts bin rather than c34. My serial number is only a few away from yours so it could be a problem...
Steve, I think Kevin is confusing shrouds (side support) with stays (fore and aft support). :?
Michael,
Necessity is the Mother of invention. It needed to be done, and pulling the mast was not an option at that time.
Steve,
It is hard to imagine, but there really is a huge difference between the stock sheaves and the BB sheaves from Garhauer.
Tom,
I wouldn't doubt it. I just imagine this performance curve in my mind where the stock sleeves have a lower performance initially (higher friction) and degrade at a somewhat steady rate over a long period of time. Overlaid on that you have the ball bearing sheaves that perform better initially and at some point in the future take a sharp downturn and drop below the performance of the standard. (More moving parts - all things fail eventually - failure mechanism is probably pretty catastrophic given the nature of the bearings - a curve with a knee).
Now if that failure and intersection point is 20 years in the future, then it is a no brainer - use ball bearing every time. If it is six or seven years out, then people will want to make decisions trading off performance and maintenance. I'm not advocating bushings over bearings, just asking if there is data to suggest that ball bearing sheaves are gonna last and perform for 20 years. I didn't know the answer when I did mine and went with new bushings (probably influenced mostly by the J-Boat captain who was hanging out in the rigging shop at the same time I was there spending his days putting new ball bearings into 5 five year old blocks while he waited for new rigging parts).
But then you've demonstrated that there is no need to pull the stick to do the sheaves, so it's probably a moot point anyway. Go for ball bearings and performance!
Our marina has a power lift to raise the boats out of the lake. If you talk real nicely to the operators, you can pull into the well and use the lift to get you over the mast head. Once there, do your deed and then your done. Cost.... a case or two of beer.....
I won't address the issue about replacing the masthead sheaves with the stick up because we did ours with the mast down, one small benefit of being on the hard for six months of the year. However, I will say that you need to have realistic expectations about how much improvement you can expect no matter what you do. We have replaced the masthead sheaves, the mast collar turning blocks and the deck organizer sheaves with the Garhauer ball bearing models. We also installed a Tides Marine track system. With all that time and money, and all the promises from the various manufacturers that "this" would result in an easy to raise and drop sail, we still need to use the winch for the last foot or so and the sail still does not come down all the way. As someone said earlier, too many turns and too much friction from the top of the mast back to the winch. That is pretty obvious if you raise the sail by pulling on the halyard where it exits the mast - I would guess that it is half as much effort as trying to haul it up hand over hand from the cockpit.
My local sail loft says the Strong track system is very good.
http://www.sailcare.com/strong-sail-track.shtml
Kevin,
I'd be very interested to hear the rigger's (Casey)opinion about using the ball bearing V/S the standard sheaves. Lets face it, most of probably still have the original sheaves that are twenty something years old and are still working. As nice as it might be to have ball bearing sheaves, if you have to replace them in 3 to 5 years, is it really worth it?
I hadn't thought about this until it was brought up on this board, but it's a very good point and I'm still curious if it can really be done with the mast up.
Mike
Mike,
I'm not a professional rigger, but I changed the sheaves on my C36 about 10 years ago. When I sold it last year, the sheaves were working as well as they had the day they were installed. Not sure what kind of sheaves the J-Boat used, but Garhauer makes some pretty decent stuff that lasts a long time.
I also installed the Strong Track system. It does everything they say it does. If you are not careful, when you let go of the main halyard, it will cut a groove in the teak at the aft end of the cabin top. The sail comes FLYING down. Still need a winch for the last foot or two, even with all BB sheaves, deck organizers, and the Strong Track system. Nature of the beast, I guess.
Tom's experience is a better data point on the life of BB sheaves in our application!
The J-Boat only alerted me to the ultimate failure mechanism. That was a 48 foot boat on its fourth circumnavigation - vastly different block design, environment, load profile, and duty cycle than masthead sheaves on a typical c34.
One more thought on the sheaves - go ball bearing. It's a non issue.
For the truly paranoid. The sheaves are protected from UV and salt spray etc. Failure is going to be related to load and use. You have 4 sheaves. Two main and two jib. If a main fails after ten years. Switch to the other and go another ten years.
For the ultra paranoid. Go half bushing, half bearing. Then if there is time based failure, you'll still have good bushing based back ups.
It's really not a big deal. If they were going to die in 3 to 5 years in this application, Garhauer would know it and wouldn't sell them.
Sorry for the paranoia propogation!
I'm looking forward to installing my ball bearing sheaves. Right now, I have to use the winch once my full batten main is just past the half-way mark! Winching just the last couple feet would be a vast improvement.
Had to postpone the appointment with my rigger today. We've actually got real weather here in San Diego and it's raining and blowing pretty bad outside today. I did however, go down to the boat to ensure everything was snug and dry (it was) so I figured while I was there I would look a little closer at some of the elements of my running rigging for the Main. I took a couple of cursory tugs on the halyard from the bottom of the mast with some slack in the line to pull only through the sheaves at the top of the mast. Really... my impression was that the halyard did not seem to have any binding or restriction. I then looked at and tested the Garhauer ball bearing blocks at the bottom of the mast. Again they seem to move freely and no binding. Then came the organizer. I am now very cognizant of the sharp 90 degree bend the line takes at this point and I also noticed that I have Schafer triple sheave organizers... The sheaves appear to be plastic and I assume are not BB.
I rescheduled the appointment with the rigger for next Wednesday to have him take a more thourough look over everything, but for now I think I could probably help things with a couple new deck organizers. I'll add that project to the list of dryer weather projects at a later date.
In the meantime, it's time for us "weather wimps" here in san Diego to hunker down and batten down the hatches for our next storm. At least it's not 2 degrees and snowing outside 8)
Snooping around online at various sights and ran accross an interesting tidbit of information regarding deck organizers from the Harken website. It states:
"Remember the load on the sheave is a factor of the load on the line, plus a factor determined by the angle of deflection - a sheave that turns a line 30 degrees sees only 52% of the load, while a sheave that turns a line 90 degrees sees 141% of the load".
Given that nugget of info it is no wonder that the later designs of the C34 moved the deck organizers a bit aft to eliminate the 90 degree turn from the mast back to the cockpit.
"The plot thickens" :santa
Kevin : Back in the mid-1990s, Dave Davis did a similar test by eliminating the turning blocks and came to same conclusion as Harkin. I believe that Dave published his data in ft. lbs. of pull rather than %, but the conclusion was the same.
Hard to believe that anyone would even consider anything else but Ball Bearing sheaves when thinking of decreasing the effort of pull. I believe I've changed all but maybe 2 sheaves on my C34, that are the originals (non BB).
Kevin, you may be interested in Dave Davis' posts:
http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,3811.0.html (http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,3811.0.html)
and
http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,1019.0.html (http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,1019.0.html)
My experience, like others since 1986, is that the last two feet needs the winch. On a "good day" :D I can raise the main from the cockpit, but many times we'll do it from the mast. We were fortunate enough to have the PO install Harken Batt-cars. Drops like a rock, goes up pretty smoothly, although requires regular lubrication with Sailkote. I recall other discussions about the alternate systems, try a search, that's how I got these two topics.
I promised everyone a follow up on my concern over the difficult Main Halyard.
Upon Mike's advice I made an appointment with Casey of KC Performance rigging here in San Diego. Having to postpone the appointments for a rigging inspection 3 times due the torrential rain we have experienced, I finally had a Chance to get my inspection completed yesterday.
Fritz Richardson, who now works with KC performance rigging and a veteran of 30 years of experience as a rigger arrived at my boat and performed the inspection.
First the good news. I do not have any Mast head sheaves frozen. Fritz was able to confirm what I had known to be true that in fact all the standing rigging on Pau Hana had been replaced and upgraded in 2006.... what a relief :D
Now the burning question.... Can the masthead sheaves be replaced with the stick still in the air????? :nail
The short answer is YES! However, like most things... this task can be accomplished for a price. Fritz had explained the process of having to rig temporay stays and the hours and effort involved to do so (roughly 20 hours labor) At this rate he estimated it could be done dockside for $2000-$2500. To have a crane at the boatyard pull the stick and perform the work would probably run $1000-$1500.
Essentially, the Mast must be brought down to change the masthead sheaves unless $$$$ is no object.
As for the difficulty I have been having in raising the Main? It really boils down to the sailplan on the earlier C34's.
The swivel blocks at the base of the mast cause a turn in the Halyard (90 degrees = resistance)
The deck organizer turns the halyard another 90 degrees (more Resistance)
The fairleads through the traveller are not a straight run and finally the halyard running through the clutches. All this turns into a buildup of Resistance.
In the end, it will probably be easier for us to raise the Main directly from the base of the mast.
(Of note... I do intend to upgrade the deck organizers to the garhaur ball bearing organizers.... this should help considerably.
On another thread I'll tell the story of my mystery Rolling Furler issue.
Kevin,
Were you happy with the services provided by KC Perfofmance Rigging? Just want to make sure my referrals are worthy.
Mike
Kevin, thanks for the update and confirming what we've all found over the years about raising the main. Your summary was very, very well written.
Craig Illman did something almost unique: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4946.0.html
That idea has spread and Rick Allen did it with a cam cleat, which I'm planning to do to replace the simple horn cleat I added years ago. Either the clutch (sheet stopper) or cam cleat are great to avoid having to return to the mast to get the last two feet winched up.
Here's Rick's cam cleat.
[rick allen cam cleat]
One last reply on this topic. Mike Stimmler refferred me to KC Performance Rigging here in san Diego. I could not have asked for a better referral for an expertly qualified and professional rigging service. If your in SD, give Casey and Fritz a call. The rates were reasonable, the service professional and the written report of the inspection (which I just received in my email) was complete and gave me a couple good recommendations for more efficient running of my Genoa Halyard as well.
Of note is the halyard tension. I suspected and confirmed that my port cabin winch had suffered considerable strain in the past. Though troublesome, it is still usable and unbelievably, Fritz of KC Performance rigging said he had a complete winch identical to mine that had been beat up and would give it to me free if I just stopped by the shop. (OF COURSE I SAID YES AND COULDNT BELIEVE THE GENEROUS OFFER). It is due to this winch that the Genoa halyard tension was difficult to attain.
I thought I would share the major points of my rigging inspection performed by KC Performance Rigging and the receomendations to improve performance.
On January 7, 2011, I visually inspected the mast, rigging and related
hardware on the 1988 Catalina 34, "Pau Hana. The mast had been pulled
back in 2006 and painted. The standing rigging, running rigging and
electrical had also been replaced. The vessel has been maintained very well
since that time and no structural problems were found. There are several
things that can be changed that will improve the handling and performance
of the boat. These are discussed in detail below.
• The Hood 800SL Genoa roller reefing system was difficult to furl.
This was being caused by inadequate halyard tension. The 800SL
system relies on the halyard to pull the drive unit up and stabilize
itself against the tie-down shackle. With the halyard slack, the unit
was rotating and this caused the furling line to bind against the cage.
From the cockpit it was very difficult to get the necessary halyard
tension. This is being caused by excess friction on the halyard as it
leads from the mast base back to the winch. The deck organizers and
fairleads as installed by Catalina create the majority of the friction.
To correct this situation will require a complete rework of the deck
hardware. In addition, the port halyard winch mounted on the cabin
top has been over-loaded and has some structural damage. An
alternative to the existing system would be to move both the winches
and stoppers to the mast.
• The mainsail halyard suffers from the same friction problem as the
Genoa halyard. I suggest for the time being the main halyard gets
jumped from the mast while the slack is taken up on the winch.
• Currently the Genoa furling line leads all the way aft and turns 180
degrees thru a Harken cam block. This turn is causing increased
friction. I suggest installing a rope-clutch mounted on a car to the
outboard track between the gate stanchion and its brace. Just aft of
this clutch a car mounted block will allow the furling line to be pulled
and locked while facing forward and keeping the line from making the
180 degree turn. The forward most fairlead block for the furling line
needs a stand-up spring to stabilize the block when it is not loaded.
• The life lines had no cracked swages or broken strands. The threaded
toggle forks on the front end of the gates need to be dismantled
cleaned and reassembled with loctite. They are slowly unscrewing.
• The Lewmar winches, except for the port cabin house winch are in
good condition. They can all use a good cleaning and lubrication.
• The cams for the mainsail traveler controls need to be replaced. They
have been stressed and the return springs are shot.
• The mainsail reefing system is not complete. The simplest way to
complete it would be to add a 5" cleat forward on the starboard side of
the boom. Next place a reefing hook bolted to the gooseneck
replacing the existing tack pin. Install a pair of stainless rings webbed
thru the existing reef tack grommet to secure on the reef hook.
Finally, install a line, approximately 25', run through the existing
track mounted car back aft for the clew line leading thru the sail
forward to the cleat.
•
Kevin,
I'm glad they treated you well as they have me. I'm sure I will have more work for them eventually.
Happy Sailing,
Mike
Just FYI, an estimate of $1000 to $1500 to unstep and step your mast seems really high to me. Our entire winter storage cost is in the middle of that range and includes the unstepping and stepping process (six months apart but that shouldn't make any difference). The differential here for storing your boat mast down is anywhere between $100 and $500. I would shop around and see if you can find a better deal.
There is no reason you need the yard to do the work itself. The top of the mast should come off relatively easily and then it is a simple process to replace the sheaves. As I remember, there is a metal pin that goes through the center is secured by a cotter pin. I would estimate it would take no more than 30 minutes unless you have a corroded bolt.
One thing you may want to look at is to make sure that your main halyard is going over the starboard sheave. Ours was going over our port sheave and then exiting the mast on the starboard side. I thought that the lateral pull of the halyard caused some resistance on the sheave.
We also took the halyard out of the deck organizer so that the halyard runs back directly from the mast collar block to the hole under the traveler. I think that helped a bit.
Per my earlier post....I am perplexed why adding purchase would not remedy this problem with much less cost and aggravation. Perhaps I'm missing something...but by installing an eye at the aft side of masthead and a block on mainsail headboard....the halyard would terminate at the eye, run down outside the mast and thru block at mainsail head, then back up to masthead sheave. I bet you could easily raise sail by hand without bb blocks, track systems etc. Only disadvantage is having about 45' more halyard on the cockpit while sail is raised. Of course, this is assuming the existing sheaves are in decent condition. The block remains with the halyard when not in use. Just shackle the block to the mainsail head to raise sail instead of the halyard end like normal. If I didn't have a furling main I can assure you I would try this set up.