This summer, we visited a couple of Catalina dealers, and neither of them were too anxious to quote or even discuss the C34. Neither of the dealers even included the C34 in their pricing lists and model comparisons and summaries. In both cases, the C350 was the model being "pushed." While not actually saying so, the strong impression being communicated was that C34 production was about to end. Has Catalina announced any plans to discontinue the C34?
You make a good point. However, someone that is selling something and 'pushes' one model over another might not be because that model is being discontinued. It may be that the dealer has more incentives and can make more profit if the C350 is purchased. It is a higher priced boat. I believe it's higher than the C36.
About a month ago I received a email from a large GA Catalina dealer, stating that the California based production of C36"s and C42"s are discontinued and that large boat manufacturing will be focused on the boats produced in Largo, FL.
I believe the C34 is produced in California!!! :?`
There was a big discussion on the C36 mailing list about a week or two ago. It sounds like all the larger boat molds were shipped to FL from CA due to environmental constraints in CA. There was talk of a new style C36, a C360 or C367? Possibly the same will be happening to the C34? Like the C36 folks, I'd hate to see the C34 "Hunterized". :cry4`
Craig
Then let's tell Frank and Gerry.
Some good information and points. An interesting aside...the Florida dealer that does not even list new C34s in their literature, will at the same time, gladly take any used C34 they can find...for an easy/fast resale. I suppose that CY must build what will sell, and the trend is away from C34 type boats, but it will be a loss to those that actually what and use a coastal cruiser.
Although some dealers may push different models, especially those that they have IN STOCK, the Catalina website still proudly shows the C34 MKII. In the interest of facts and not WAG's on my part, I emailed Frank to see if he would respond to me or the board on the future of the C34.
If I hear from him I will post his reply.
Tom
Well you can say what you want to about Catalina's response to emails but after reading this post I called Catalina in California and asked if Frank Butler was available. I was put through to him immediately! That says something to me that you can pick up the phone and talk to the president of Catalina Yachts. Try that with Hunter!
He said that toolings for the C36 were moved to Fla and they are considering doing that with the C34 and C42 because of EPA regulations but no decision has been made yet. He said that it's easier to produce boats in Fla.
As far as discontinuing any of the boats he was very positive about that NOT happening.
I also mentioned that some dealers were pushing other models other than the C34 and he had no knowledge of that and couldn't understand why that would happen and reassured me that they do in fact have C34's and C42's available at the factory
Just makes me feel all warm and fuzzy that I picked the right boat to buy.
Mike
Mike : Good for you!!
You've just proved my saying:
"Talk to the manufacture and you're getting it straight from the horses mouth! Get it off the internet and you don't know which end of the horse is speaking!?!" :D
Mike - Thanks for clearing up the rumors, but I expect whatever happens to the C36 will happen to the C34 a few years down the road.
Craig
For those who share the desire of continued production of the 34 may I suggest we communicate to Frank Butler updated change we would like to see in the C34 ? These changes should keep in mind ease of introduction into the assembly process and stay in tune with established Catalina engineering. Not to copy any other sailboat but to keep alive the purchase option of the traditional Catalina 34. Those more knowledgable than I on sailboat engineering and accessories should be able to contribute the best of ideas to a sailboat manufacturer who listens and values his loyal customers. :clap I would hate to see the C34 retired by another Catalina design. What a good project for the Catalina 34 Association?
Even though the C36 production is being moved to Florida, their still planning to continue making them for a long time.
Would be interesting to see if the C36 produced in Fl will have a different non-skid pattern on deck. Seems like the boats produced in Fl have that stucco look, which I feel is not as eye pleasing as the diamond pattern. Kind of makes the deck look cheap. I believe the C320, which is now made in Fl has that stucco pattern.
Just received the monthly letter from Turner Marine, a large Catalina dealer, the letter states that the Catalina 34 will be dicontinued after the last 10 in production will be finished. Also they will no longer produce the c36. They will produce the 47,42,40,38,35,32,309!!
I guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens and whose fibbing
While I like my C34 and this board I wish they would come out with a 37 1/2 LOA. My marina and others allow 3ft over the size of the slip. Since the C34 won't fit in a 30' slip I'm in a 35' slip which would berth something 3 ft larger for the same price. The C380 needs to be just a few inches shorter. The 'Admiral' would like a big centerline aft cabin and would then spend more nights at the islands.
The c350 is 36'5'' and the c36 is 37'9''. Either of those would fit.
I don't find the C36 a big enough difference to change boats. I like the C350 but it doesn't have the large aft cabin like the C38x's. The front berth isn't bad but the Admiral doesn't like it.
There just isn't a perfect boat so in the meantime I'll keep enjoying the one I have!
when we were buying we looked at both the 36's and 34's and as nice as the 36's are, there was just something about the layout of the 34's that appealed to us and we preferred the aft haed.I don't think you'll get "bang for the buck" than the c34
and the world's LARGEST V berth.
and the Mk I's very large head!! .... along with excellent engine access!! :clap
Well would an end to Catalina's production of the 34 be good or bad for owners and the association?
Does it matter?
Most likely...
The two sides of the possibilities:
1. Boats gain greater value because they are one of the best boats of it's size, easy to singlehanded, perfect for a couple, all the stuff already written in FAQs, boat builder is still in business, parts always available, etc.
2. People avoid interest because it's an "old" design, no longer in production, it's not "cool" to have an "old" boat - of course, missing the point
No reason for the company to NOT stop production if people are buying other boats with maybe not such great sea keeping abilities, bigger boats make more $$, etc.
Either way, so much is directly proportional to how well your boat is kept up and maintained. Ours is 21 years old, as are many others, and in wonderful condition with upgraded systems, thanks a lot to this website and its contributors.
I just bought a 19 year old boat. The fact that they are still in production didn't make a bit of difference in purchase decision. There is a big difference between a two year old MKII and and nineteen year old MK1 even if they are basically the same boat. I was comparing to other boats of similar price and vintage. Having a strong association and a resource to draw on had a big appeal. So value is probably more heavily influenced by the number of boats out there and their popularity and involvement of the owners. Long term availability of parts etc is more dependent on size of the production run than anything else.
Now if you own a very new MKII it's probably a different deal. The latest model Beneteau or Hunter or whatever that is still in production might have a slight advantage over a discontinued Catalina. But in five years it won't make a bit of difference. It's the boat that matters. Look at a ten year old Hunter and it looks like a dated design sitting next to a C34 ten years older.
If Catalina is still in business, it probably doesn't make a bit of difference if the model is discontinued.
I think the bottom line comes to profits. Ultimately, a company is in business to make money, if they don't, they're out of business. A company is going to put resources into products that would generate the highest profit with items that consumers want. There would come a time when volumes of a particular product are not big enough to sustain the effort, and it makes more sense to commit resources toward another product (i.e. 320, 350?). Maybe the orders for a C34 while still coming in, are at the point where Catalina feels they should target more effort in other sizes. I work in the consumer products business in a very large company that makes products you use everyday. Even if an item generates $1-2MM a year (a lot for us!), that might not be worth supporting and it's delisted.
The other thing I noticed is over the past several years, boat builders created a product line that had models available in one foot size increments. That's when boat sales were flying through the roof and the company was able to sustain such a varied offering. From what I see now, things have been softer, so builders may need to scale back. I can see Catalina adjusting their line by updating it with the '0' models (310, 320, 350) and separating the sizes with more than just a one foot increment.
I'm interested to see what models will be shown at the upcoming Annapolis show. I think last year, the C34 was not there.
I certainly would feel bad if the C34 would float no more in the Catalina product line. But I am sure glad I got one when I did because she's such a wonderful boat to sail!
Roc,
At the Newport show this past weekend the Catalina's that were there were the - 440 Morgan (butt ugly, in my opinion), 42 with a Pullman berth, 387, 350, 320, 309, and surprisingly... a 28! The presentation was put on by a broker, Eastern Yacht Sales, not Catalina.
I agree with waterdog's assessment that discontinuing production on any given model probably will not affect resale value for existing boats. It's a different market, but I do think the new boat market, regardless of make/model, influences sales for used. In fact, last year I had gone to the Newport show and sat with a salesman, going over the numbers for a new 310. I had every intention of buying one, but after looking at the cost it was about 12% higher than I had anticipated. Not huge, but enough to give pause. Just as a "safety" measure I asked what else he had in slightly used and was pointed to Ruach. I made an offer 1/2 hour after stepping on her. Probably would have made the offer from the dock had the admiral not been with me.
As for what Catalina is going to do, I think it more beneficial that the company and it's brand does well. Capital is a finite commodity and, as you suggest, a good company will put their capital to work on products that earn it the highest internal rate of return. That's just good business sense.
As much as I would like to see the C34 remain in production, I'm much more concerned at seeing a financially sound Catalina.
I keep wondering how many new boats bought in the past 5-10 years were paid for by tapping home equity. If that resource continues to tighten and/ or shrink I suspect new boat sales could be impacted quite a bit.
Quote from: Stephen Butler on August 22, 2007, 02:15:17 AM
This summer, we visited a couple of Catalina dealers, and neither of them were too anxious to quote or even discuss the C34. Neither of the dealers even included the C34 in their pricing lists and model comparisons and summaries. In both cases, the C350 was the model being "pushed." While not actually saying so, the strong impression being communicated was that C34 production was about to end. Has Catalina announced any plans to discontinue the C34?
Maybe someone else with a better memory can fill in the blank but I can't remmember the last time I saw a 34 at a boat show (Atlantic City, Annapolis & Philly) and I've been going for more than a few years. I don't think Catalina ever "pushed" our boat.
I purchased a new 34 at the Newport Boat Show in September of 2004 which is the last time I saw a 34 at that or any other boat show I have gone to. I liked the interior volume of the 35, the salon of the 36 but overall the best bang for the buck was without question the 34. I have no regrets and anytime I go to a boat show I look at other boats and nothing measures up (in my eyes) to the 34. Great Boat!
This past April at the Strictly Sail at Jack London Square (Oakland) both a 34 and a 36 were represented.
There has been a 34 at the last two Toronto boat shows (January 2006 and 2007). Having a boat there seems to depend on a new owner agreeing to have their boat displayed, usually in return for some concessions from the dealer. Maybe all the new C34 owners in other areas wanted to sail rather than see their boat at the show? :D
It was at the 2006 show that we firmed up our decision to get a 34 as our next boat, rather than the 320 we had been considering. Being able to do a side by side comparison made it a no-brainer.
Tony
[/quote]
Maybe someone else with a better memory can fill in the blank but I can't remmember the last time I saw a 34 at a boat show (Atlantic City, Annapolis & Philly) and I've been going for more than a few years. I don't think Catalina ever "pushed" our boat.
[/quote]
Hmmm, maybe then its just a northeast thing, I wonder why Frank B's ignoring us? :cry4` :?
I've seen the 34 both at the Long Beach boat show and the Channel Islands boat show for the last several years. Maybe they are easy to show in Southern California since they are built here. The Long Beach show started today and there is suppose to be a 34 in the water.
2007 CATALINA YACHT ANCHORAGE CALENDAR OF EVENTS
Thursday September 20th – Sunday September 23rd
Long Beach Boat Show
on display:
Catalina 309, 320, 34, 387, 42, 440, 470
C-Dory 25 Cruiser, 22 Cruiser, 22 Angler, 22 Center Cockpit, 19 Angler
Tom Cat 255
Ranger Tug 21 ec and Ranger Tug 25
Paul has a good point. The 34 and 36 (at least up until now) have been built in So Cal; the 350 in Florida. Depending on which coast one lives, shipping will add several thousand dollars to the price of one model or another. Does anybody know where the 320 is built?
The 320 is built in Florida
Also check out the update on the catalina web page the 36 is not listed but the 34 is
Paul
1634
Yachta Yachta Yachta
I just got back from San Diego and heard that the Catalina dealer in S.D. lost their franchise or contract to sell Catalina Yachts because Catalina is going to start selling dirrectly, eliminating brokers and wil be opening their own sales offices in major cities. Anyone else heard anything like this?
I do not think that the continuation of the C34, or the dropping of it, has much impact on the marketability of used Catalinas. In fact, if anything it may raise value somewhat based on limited availability. Whether they continue with C34 and C36, will not impact the pleasure I get from owning the C34.
That said, I would hope that Catalina is not thinking of desolving their dealer network in favor of in house sales. Hopefully the rumor is sour grapes from a dealer that did lose their Catalina franchise for good reason. If Catalina ends up doing their own sales you can almost guarantee that their service level will fall, their costs will rise, they will pass those costs on to the consumer more directly, and the franchise will suffer. There is a reason that most dealers represent more than one brand...........spreading expenses and the bottom line!
Quote from: Mike and Joanne Stimmler on September 23, 2007, 09:23:34 PM
I just got back from San Diego and heard that the Catalina dealer in S.D. lost their franchise or contract to sell Catalina Yachts because Catalina is going to start selling dirrectly, eliminating brokers and wil be opening their own sales offices in major cities. Anyone else heard anything like this?
Silly,
The investment Catalina would have to make in order for this to happen would be enormous. I've seen numerous franchises get the boot from Catalina and I'm sure they all had sour grapes.
//Here's tha latest scoop from the horses mouth. A good friend is related to Gerry Douglas and they quiried him regarding the continued production. This should settle the rumors.
"We saw Gerry Douglas at the island last weekend and got the word on the 34. YES, they are still making the boat but production has moved to Florida. Gerry said that Catalinas sell far better on the East Coast than out here. Think he said the ratio is something like 10 to 1. Sounds reasonable as there is a longer coastline to cruise back there."
Was at the Annapolis Boat show Friday - 22, 250,28 309, 320 34, 350 and 387 are alive The 27, 310 and 36 are done - no more. Some production is being shifted to Florida.
Just occurred to me, as it might have to Frank and Gerry and Sharon: Tiger Woods and a lot of other rich people live in Florida BECAUSE; no taxes...
Connect the dots... :clap
Hi guys...I've just checked the catalina Y site and it confirms Frankr's saying....the 34 is still there but no more 27,310,36, etc....
See site: http://www.catalinayachts.com/
Guys : If the C34 were to go out of production, would it really make a difference to C34 owners ? - as long as the Catalina Factory were still there to support the hulls that had been produced?
I didn't hear of any group of C30 owners that "locked arms and jumped off the cliff" when C30 production stopped?!? The factory is still there to support those 6000 ++ hulls out there.
A thought. :wink:
We were told today at the Boat Show that they had indeed made the decision a while back to drop the C34, and then changed their minds. Hence the confusion.......
I also spoke with Gerry at Annapolis. He didn't confirm it, but the replacement for the 36 will probably be in the 37' range, fills a gap in the line up. Also a rumor (not from Gerry) that the stern may be a bit narrower than the current designs. The 34 will be made in 2008, but said it would be a yearly decision.
This continues at: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php?topic=3929.0