Join the C34 Association Today!
[C34 Home] [C34Tech Notes] [C34 Tech Wiki] [Join!]
Please login or register.
Advanced search  

News:

Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Down

Author Topic: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump  (Read 1009 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

britinusa

  • Forum - Chief Petty Officer
  • ******
  • Karma: 4
  • Posts: 814
    • View Profile
    • Sailing Eximius
Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« on: June 14, 2018, 07:32:24 AM »

We found a fuel seepage leak was due to a patch of corrosion (I know, Aluminum) on the outside (port) side of the tank about 1" above the bottom welded edge. Luckily I found it before it turned into a stream as we had a full fuel tank at the time.

Drained the tank using our spare fuel pump, removed the tank, found the leak, cleaned it up, JB Water Weld and tested by putting fuel in the tank at home. Reinstalled tank, Reconnected all hoses, bonding and fuel contents sender.

Ran the fuel pump for 10 minutes with the bleed screw open max, but it did not calm down to the regular 'tick tick tick'. Ran the engine, all good, at least for about 5-10 minutes when the engine died, sounded like a lack of fuel (stutter stutter stop)

Removed the fuel return hose from the tank, ran the fuel pump (just turned the ignition on), no discharge.

Replaced fuel filter (it was about due), would not prime on it's own, sucked fuel into the filter (just inserted a transparent hose into the output of the filter and took a deep breath) fuel flowed into the fuel filter bowl.
Engine will not run, assumed due to lack of fuel.

Tried to suck fuel through the pump (used the transparent hose connected to the output of the pump) but it was a dead end, total block.

Replaced the fuel pump (guessing it's the original fuel pump 30 years old, corroded top) with the spare, $46 on amazon, primed it by sucking fuel through a transparent hose. Connected up the fuel hoses.
Disconnected the return hose at the tank, ran the pump, fuel flowing, life is good.

Ran engine for 15 minutes, life is good.

So, question: Did I destroy the old fuel pump by running it dry during the post tank reinstall engine run when, I'm assuming, the engine ran on the fuel that was in the line from the pump to the engine?

BTW, the new pump is much quieter than the old one.

New spare pump is arriving today thanks to Amazon prime.

Paul

Logged
Paul & Peggy
1987 C34 Tall Rig Fin Keel - Hull # 463

See you out on the water

Engine:M25XP

KWKloeber

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
  • ********
  • Karma: 30
  • Posts: 2960
  • "Positive Impact" 1984 C-30 #3573 trbsfk M-25
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #1 on: June 14, 2018, 07:45:18 AM »

Paul

The pump, like a bilge pump, can run dry without harm.
I missed in your scenario-did you see if the pump would pump on it’s own, disconnect somewhere before the injector pump?

You just likely and coincidentally hit it’s drop dead date. MTBF is “only” 30 yrs. you’re really pushing it at “31”. Ha!  (I’m pushing 34 yrs)

A link to your replacement pump?

-k
Logged
Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed
by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
So throw off the bowlines.
Sail away from the safe harbor.
Catch the tradewinds in your sails.
Explore. Dream. Discover.   -Mark Twain

britinusa

  • Forum - Chief Petty Officer
  • ******
  • Karma: 4
  • Posts: 814
    • View Profile
    • Sailing Eximius
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #2 on: June 14, 2018, 06:28:59 PM »

Ken, yes, I disconnected the outlet of the old facet pump and connected a piece of fuel hose to the outlet, nuttin!!

The Amazon pumps seem to work fine (at least 10minutes so far  8) ) and the 2nd spare arrived tonight.

Paul
Logged
Paul & Peggy
1987 C34 Tall Rig Fin Keel - Hull # 463

See you out on the water

Engine:M25XP

KWKloeber

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
  • ********
  • Karma: 30
  • Posts: 2960
  • "Positive Impact" 1984 C-30 #3573 trbsfk M-25
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #3 on: June 14, 2018, 07:48:06 PM »

Sounds like you’ll be “spared” 😖 the agony of a tow.
Don’t keep a secret about what you got. That’s s great price!

Logged
Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed
by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
So throw off the bowlines.
Sail away from the safe harbor.
Catch the tradewinds in your sails.
Explore. Dream. Discover.   -Mark Twain

britinusa

  • Forum - Chief Petty Officer
  • ******
  • Karma: 4
  • Posts: 814
    • View Profile
    • Sailing Eximius
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #4 on: June 15, 2018, 06:05:06 AM »

Here's the link to Amazon

http://a.co/isiqkLc

Paul
Logged
Paul & Peggy
1987 C34 Tall Rig Fin Keel - Hull # 463

See you out on the water

Engine:M25XP

Ron Hill

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
  • ********
  • Karma: 51
  • Posts: 6525
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2018, 08:59:24 AM »

Paul : Looks like "Same Same" fuel pump as your OEM Fasut pump @ a MUCH better price!!

My thought
Logged
Ron, Apache #788

pjcomeau

  • Forum - Petty Officer 2nd Class
  • ****
  • Karma: 1
  • Posts: 130
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2018, 05:33:20 AM »

I had not seen this before my latest update on my post. I see the pump you picked up is rated max 5.5 psi (I have found a local source for the Facet pump with same rating), but from I see in Catalina Direct (and I think from the universal parts list) that the pump they have has the same 32gph, but a max of 8 psi. So, from what I'm reading you are not seeing any problems with your pump when in gear/cruising speed?
Logged
Pierre Comeau
Time To Keel, 1988 #687  Saint John, NB Canada

Ron Hill

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
  • ********
  • Karma: 51
  • Posts: 6525
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2018, 01:10:30 PM »

Pierre : The engine on a C34 will run without the fuel pump as the tank is higher than the engine with the fuel gravity feeding!! Especially if the tank is at least half full!!

A thought
Logged
Ron, Apache #788

pjcomeau

  • Forum - Petty Officer 2nd Class
  • ****
  • Karma: 1
  • Posts: 130
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2018, 02:29:07 PM »

Ron, I saw a number of reference  to this  fact including  a more recent  test by  Stu. How would you bleed without the pump. Also, if this is the  case  why  is it a problem  when these pumps  fails? Is  it  that if they  are present  and  not working  properly  they impede flow ?
Logged
Pierre Comeau
Time To Keel, 1988 #687  Saint John, NB Canada

Noah

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer
  • *******
  • Karma: 18
  • Posts: 1300
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2018, 04:38:50 PM »

I believe Ron’s “pumpless” strategy could be used in an emergency, but his caveats that the tank needs to be at least half full, and the engine primed and running, in my opinion, would negate this as a pemanant engine running regime.
Logged
1990 hull #1014, San Diego, CA,  Fin Keel,
Standard Rig

britinusa

  • Forum - Chief Petty Officer
  • ******
  • Karma: 4
  • Posts: 814
    • View Profile
    • Sailing Eximius
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2018, 08:06:33 PM »

I had not seen this before my latest update on my post. I see the pump you picked up is rated max 5.5 psi (I have found a local source for the Facet pump with same rating), but from I see in Catalina Direct (and I think from the universal parts list) that the pump they have has the same 32gph, but a max of 8 psi. So, from what I'm reading you are not seeing any problems with your pump when in gear/cruising speed?

We saw no issues when running the engine at 2,000 rpm or above.

If we were consuming 32gph I would be seriously worried, it's more like 0.75gph :)

Paul
Logged
Paul & Peggy
1987 C34 Tall Rig Fin Keel - Hull # 463

See you out on the water

Engine:M25XP

Roland Gendreau

  • Forum - Petty Officer 1st Class
  • *****
  • Karma: 2
  • Posts: 234
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #11 on: July 02, 2018, 05:58:03 PM »

Regarding the ability of the m25xp engine to run without the electric pump, my engine recently would not run when the pump failed even though the tank was over 3/4 full.   I concluded that the fuel could not siphon through a failed NAPA pump.  I did not try to eliminate the pump in order to get the engine to run as I was able to sail the rest of the way back to my mooring.
Logged
Roland Gendreau
1992 MK 1.5
Gratitude #1183
Bristol, RI

Bobg

  • Forum - Petty Officer 1st Class
  • *****
  • Karma: 2
  • Posts: 368
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #12 on: July 03, 2018, 06:45:52 AM »

So what is the process if your pump fails.  if the engine can run without the pump when the tank is full, does the fuel pass through the failed pump or do we have to bypass it, if so, how do we bleed the system, i'm thinking we crack the knurled knob and let gravity do its job? I have never had a problem and I just received my spare pump from amazon but curious about running without pump in a emergency situation
Logged
Bob Gatz, 1988 catalina 34, Hull#818, "Ghostrider" sail lake superior Apostle Islands

rmbrown

  • Forum - Petty Officer 1st Class
  • *****
  • Karma: 0
  • Posts: 262
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2018, 07:02:25 AM »

You guys have me confused...  the fuel pump on my M35AC looks like this.  Is mine original or is that something someone used as a replacement at some point that may or may not be doing the job correctly?

Logged
Mike Brown
1993 C34 Tall Rig Wing Keel Mk 1.5
CTYP1251L293
Just Limin'
Universal M-35AC

KWKloeber

  • Forum - Master Chief Petty Officer of the Navy
  • ********
  • Karma: 30
  • Posts: 2960
  • "Positive Impact" 1984 C-30 #3573 trbsfk M-25
    • View Profile
Re: Did I destroy my Facet Fuel Pump
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2018, 09:02:56 AM »

Mike

Ck the partz manual - p43 shows the pump used.  Or that *should* have been used (insert usual caveats here.)  The “AC” on your pump doesn’t derive from your engine model number.

Didn’t we have some conversations previously about *stuff* on your engine that isn’t OEM?  Like the oil switch - or (CRS) was that someone else?

-k
Logged
Twenty years from now you'll be more disappointed
by the things you didn't do, than by the ones you did.
So throw off the bowlines.
Sail away from the safe harbor.
Catch the tradewinds in your sails.
Explore. Dream. Discover.   -Mark Twain
Pages: [1] 2 3   Go Up